Clutch replace- Can't change gears while engine runs

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JNijst
Netherlands
Posts: 123
Joined: Sat Apr 07, 2007 12:58 pm
Location: Eindhoven, Netherlands

Clutch replace- Can't change gears while engine runs

Post by JNijst »

Gents,

This article is written for non-mechanics like myself with excess details to smooth the fear of having information-gaps that seem unsurmountable at first and other panic-questions...
BTW when I write gearbox; I mean tranny - transmission

In my case I had left my Pinz in the garage for 6 months and the clutch-plate got stuck; I got the engine running, but could not shift into any gears.
Reason: the clutch-plate is 'stuck' / rusted onto either the flywheel or the pressure-plate. Probably through excess moisture in the air when parking the truck.
Look up the Internet how dry clutches work and where the flywheel is (on the crankshaft) and the pressureplate (bolted on the flywheel), the clutch-plate is inbetween

If it is stuck lightly ; With the engine OFF, put her in 1st gear, better in 4th gear as more power is exerted, and make sure there is plenty space ahead of the truck and then just start the truck. It will jerk forward as the startmotor just 'runs' the truck and almost always now the engine catches on and you drive the Pinz on the engine, push the clutch-pedal in several times and the clutch-plate might get loose and you can now shift gears. If not, then it is stuck hard...
Here are several posts on it:
viewtopic.php?f=13&t=8783&hilit=stuck+clutch
viewtopic.php?f=13&t=5902&p=43952&hilit ... tch#p43952,
http://www.real4x4forums.com/PinzgauerB ... 13&t=10780

If it is stuck hard and driving over bumps and hard breaking (with clutch pushed in) does not help; you need remove the cardan-shaft, gear-box and clutch-bellhousing to get to the clutch-assembly and 'free' the clutch-plate from either the flywheel or the pressure-plate. It seemed a big job, but it is really simple and managed to do this by myself and my mechanical experience with cars was zero, I have never even taken a bicycle apart.

What you need is:
- One Clutch alignment tool (SAV: SAV2725 = $9.50 + postage) (I bought a plastic $6.50 GM-10 one (Ebay) and spent 30 min grinding it down so it would fit... Buy the real deal !)
- Ratched with metric 10, 13, 15, 17 and 19 size sockets and spanners that size.
- A 6 mm Allen-key
- A torque wrench, that measures as low as 20 Nm, you need 22-25 Nm, although I believe you can maybe judge the strength required
- 2 ft strong electrical wire
- One strong strap with rachet
- One regular jack
- One Jack-stand: the type where you adjust to a set height and the ratchet keeps it there (see photo)
- Several blocks of wood - prevent Pinz from rolling and 'match' differences in height when jacking up and down
- Plastic sheet (oil drips/spils) and something comfortable to lay on and a head support (big block of wood)
- Some small plastic trays (from take-away-chinese) to hold nuts for the different parts

Preparation:
- Park the Pinz where you can comfortably get at the underside of the truck.
- Apply the parking brake and put some wooden blocks behind the tires, you don't want it to go anywhere...
- Put gearbox in Free
- Lay down large plastic sheet and comfy mat (don't lay with your back on cold ground) and the tools and maybe lights for the dark spots
- Remove the gearbox-access-hatch-cover in the back of the truck

Execution:
DSCF1564.JPG
DSCF1564.JPG (167.08 KiB) Viewed 2981 times
1 - First support the engine with a Jack-stand: Use regular jack to lift engine 1-2 mm and then put a jack-stand under it with pieces of wood so they fit tight.
DSCF1586.JPG
DSCF1586.JPG (184.31 KiB) Viewed 2981 times
2 - Build a make-shift bridge to hold the gearbox later with the ratchable strap (Don't use a thin crossbar-beam like I did, but had nothing else... It needs to support 39 kg)
DSCF1592.JPG
DSCF1592.JPG (163.56 KiB) Viewed 2981 times
3 - Wire the two ends of the cardan-shaft, so they cannot slide apart (some mark them, but with all that grease easily wipes off). They are balanced together and when they're apart: no telling of the correct position anymore (This is more fool-proof, like for me...)
DSCF1600.JPG
DSCF1600.JPG (127.51 KiB) Viewed 2981 times
4 - Remove the nut (size 17) from the gear-shifting-rod-guide that connects to the weird two-pronged bit at the end of the thick tube
DSCF1601.JPG
DSCF1601.JPG (100.19 KiB) Viewed 2981 times
5 - Remove the nut (size 19) that connects the gear-shifting-rod to the gear-selector-arm of the gearbox. Keep the ring under the nut together with the nut !!

/// Continue to section 2 ///
Pinz of rock - 710M / 1975 (Austrian Army)
JNijst
Netherlands
Posts: 123
Joined: Sat Apr 07, 2007 12:58 pm
Location: Eindhoven, Netherlands

Clutch stuck: Cannot change gears whille engine runs Part 5

Post by JNijst »

/// Part 5 , continuing from Part 4... ///

DSCF1544.JPG
DSCF1544.JPG (183.2 KiB) Viewed 2980 times
21 - Luckily ... ?? the clutch-plate was stuck to the pressure-plate and not on the flywheel, which means I could take the clutch-unit off, instead of working underneath the truck.
If it was stuck on the flywheel; I would use a piece of wood and try to hammer on the pressure-plate-side to pry it loose, but would have at least 1, or better 2, bolts still threaded in a bit, so if it comes off suddenly it cannot fall to the ground, or your face....
In case it is stuck on the pressure-plate: remove the clutch-unit (as in picture), then on a bench stand the unit up on its side, place a piece of wood against clutch-plate-grooved-sleeve and bash it loose (a good whack as it is stuck hard) from the pressure-plate-housing in one go.
DSCF1563.JPG
DSCF1563.JPG (147.83 KiB) Viewed 2980 times
22 - Without going into too much detail (huh ?), I just sanded all the exposed surfaces with 80 sand-paper. (Flywheel, pressure-plate and both sides of the clutch-plate) It seems that the 'rope' in the clutch-plate swelled from the moisture and got it stuck to the pressure-plate. The picture shows the sanded area from the pressure-plate. It looks the same as the flywheel. Sanded the clutch-plate slightly also, the remove any 'swollen' rope on the clutch-plate.
DSCF1566.JPG
DSCF1566.JPG (219.91 KiB) Viewed 2980 times
23 - The clutch-alignment-tool did not fit and had to remove excess material to make it fit, next time I'll buy from SAV
DSCF1578.JPG
DSCF1578.JPG (185.88 KiB) Viewed 2980 times
24 - Put the alignment-tool in the clutch-plate-sleeve and insert both in the flywheel
DSCF1543_s.jpg
DSCF1543_s.jpg (179.67 KiB) Viewed 2980 times
25 - Now you have to bolt the pressure-plate back on the flywheel. The manual says to use a torque-wrench and apply 22-25 Nm torque. Make sure the clutch-plate has not sagged if the alignment-tool fits too loosely. Even half a millimeter causes trouble aligning it all later. After all 6 nuts are in, remove the alignment tool !
Pinz of rock - 710M / 1975 (Austrian Army)
JNijst
Netherlands
Posts: 123
Joined: Sat Apr 07, 2007 12:58 pm
Location: Eindhoven, Netherlands

Clutch stuck: Cannot shift gears while engine runs Part 4

Post by JNijst »

/// Part 4, continuing from part 3 ///

By now all the bolts are off, that hold the gearbox in place !
Make sure the strap supports the gearbox and that the jack & jack-stand underneath support it, in case it suddenly comes off !!

DSCF1532.JPG
DSCF1532.JPG (154.42 KiB) Viewed 2981 times
16 - Now wriggle the gearbox backwards, pull up and down on the cardan-shaft-end and pull backwards... (muscle-power needed...)
DSCF1534.JPG
DSCF1534.JPG (182.2 KiB) Viewed 2981 times
17 - Just pulling it straight backwards, means the gear-selector-arm will hang up on the central tube, so you have to turn the whole assembly sideways !!
DSCF1536.JPG
DSCF1536.JPG (166.19 KiB) Viewed 2981 times
18 - After turning it sideways, you still need to wriggle it about to lower it.
DSCF1539.JPG
DSCF1539.JPG (181.25 KiB) Viewed 2981 times
19 - Let the strap out so that the gearbox-assembly can lower a few inches. Now assist its descent with the jack, until the strap is tight. Support gearbox with the jack and re-loosen the strap.
Then let it lower again on the jack, etc...
DSCF1543_s.jpg
DSCF1543_s.jpg (179.67 KiB) Viewed 2981 times
20 - Now, after removing the gearbox with bellhousing, the Clutch-pressure-plate is visible... Remove the 6 bolts (size 17) near yellow lines


/// Continue to Part 5... ///
Pinz of rock - 710M / 1975 (Austrian Army)
JNijst
Netherlands
Posts: 123
Joined: Sat Apr 07, 2007 12:58 pm
Location: Eindhoven, Netherlands

Clutch replacement (was: Can't shift while engine runs)

Post by JNijst »

Gents,

This article is written for non-mechanics like myself with excess details to smooth the fear of having information-gaps that seem unsurmountable at first and other panic-questions...
BTW when I write gearbox; I mean tranny - transmission

In my case I had left my Pinz in the garage for 6 months and the clutch-plate got stuck; I got the engine running, but could not shift into any gears.
Reason: the clutch-plate is 'stuck' / rusted onto either the flywheel or the pressure-plate. Probably through excess moisture in the air when parking the truck.
Look up the Internet how dry clutches work and where the flywheel is (on the crankshaft) and the pressureplate (bolted on the flywheel), the clutch-plate is inbetween

If it is stuck lightly ; With the engine OFF, put her in 1st gear, better in 4th gear as more power is exerted, and make sure there is plenty space ahead of the truck and then just start the truck. It will jerk forward as the startmotor just 'runs' the truck and almost always now the engine catches on and you drive the Pinz on the engine, push the clutch-pedal in several times and the clutch-plate might get loose and you can now shift gears. If not, then it is stuck hard...
Here are several posts on it:
viewtopic.php?f=13&t=8783&hilit=stuck+clutch
viewtopic.php?f=13&t=5902&p=43952&hilit ... tch#p43952,
http://www.real4x4forums.com/PinzgauerB ... 13&t=10780

If it is stuck hard and driving over bumps and hard breaking (with clutch pushed in) does not help; you need remove the cardan-shaft, gear-box and clutch-bellhousing to get to the clutch-assembly and 'free' the clutch-plate from either the flywheel or the pressure-plate. It seemed a big job, but it is really simple and managed to do this by myself and my mechanical experience with cars was zero, I have never even taken a bicycle apart.

What you need is:
- One Clutch alignment tool (SAV: SAV2725 = $9.50 + postage) (I bought a plastic $6.50 GM-10 one (Ebay) and spent 30 min grinding it down so it would fit... Buy the real deal !)
- Ratched with metric 10, 13, 15, 17 and 19 size sockets and spanners that size.
- A 6 mm Allen-key
- A torque wrench, that measures as low as 20 Nm, you need 22-25 Nm, although I believe you can maybe judge the strength required
- 2 ft strong electrical wire
- One strong strap with rachet
- One regular jack
- One Jack-stand: the type where you adjust to a set height and the ratchet keeps it there (see photo)
- Several blocks of wood - prevent Pinz from rolling and 'match' differences in height when jacking up and down
- Plastic sheet (oil drips/spils) and something comfortable to lay on and a head support (big block of wood)
- Some small plastic trays (from take-away-chinese) to hold nuts for the different parts

Preparation:
- Park the Pinz where you can comfortably get at the underside of the truck.
- Apply the parking brake and put some wooden blocks behind the tires, you don't want it to go anywhere...
- Put gearbox in Free
- Lay down large plastic sheet and comfy mat (don't lay with your back on cold ground) and the tools and maybe lights for the dark spots
- Remove the gearbox-access-hatch-cover in the back of the truck

Execution:
DSCF1500.JPG
DSCF1500.JPG (178.69 KiB) Viewed 2991 times
1 - First support the engine with a Jack-stand: Use regular jack to lift engine 1-2 mm and then put a jack-stand under it with pieces of wood so they fit tight.
DSCF1505.JPG
DSCF1505.JPG (166.32 KiB) Viewed 2991 times
2 - Build a make-shift bridge to hold the gearbox later with the ratchable strap (Don't use a thin crossbar-beam like I did, but had nothing else... It needs to support 39 kg)
DSCF1504.JPG
DSCF1504.JPG (156.59 KiB) Viewed 2991 times
3 - Wire the two ends of the cardan-shaft, so they cannot slide apart (some mark them, but with all that grease easily wipes off). They are balanced together and when they're apart: no telling of the correct position anymore (This is more fool-proof, like for me...)
DSCF1520.JPG
DSCF1520.JPG (166.58 KiB) Viewed 2991 times
4 - Remove the nut (size 17) from the gear-shifting-rod-guide that connects to the weird two-pronged bit at the end of the thick tube
DSCF1511_c.jpg
DSCF1511_c.jpg (122.71 KiB) Viewed 2991 times
5 - Remove the nut (size 19) that connects the gear-shifting-rod to the gear-selector-arm of the gearbox. Keep the ring under the nut together with the nut !!

/// Continue to section 2 ///
Pinz of rock - 710M / 1975 (Austrian Army)
JNijst
Netherlands
Posts: 123
Joined: Sat Apr 07, 2007 12:58 pm
Location: Eindhoven, Netherlands

Clutch stuck: Cannot shift gears while engine runs Part 1

Post by JNijst »

/// Part 2, continuing from part 1 ///

DSCF1540.JPG
DSCF1540.JPG (169.76 KiB) Viewed 2995 times
6 - Unscrew the 6 bolts and nuts (size 13) of the cardan-shaft at the gearbox end
DSCF1482.JPG
DSCF1482.JPG (171.85 KiB) Viewed 2995 times
7 - Ensure that the wire, holding the cardan-shaft-parts together, is tied off somewhere above, so the cardan-shaft cannot fall all the way down.
DSCF1488.JPG
DSCF1488.JPG (188.87 KiB) Viewed 2995 times
8 - If needed; pry the two apart, mine spilt a tablespoon or 2 oil with it, when the cardan-shaft suddenly parted...
DSCF1493.JPG
DSCF1493.JPG (154.24 KiB) Viewed 2995 times
9 - Remove the 4 large (size 17) nuts from the bellhousing, two on bottom... (Ratchet with 17 socket is easier to use , but I just could 't find the 17 socket...
DSCF1495.JPG
DSCF1495.JPG (156.06 KiB) Viewed 2995 times
10 - and two size 17 nuts on top...
Pinz of rock - 710M / 1975 (Austrian Army)
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VinceAtReal4x4s
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Re: Clutch replace- Can't change gears while engine runs

Post by VinceAtReal4x4s »

I'll leave this here but keep it locked so you can copy and paste any text you may want to use in the new thread. I'll delete it after.
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