So I fixed my transfer case and some how in the process my locker indicator lights went out. I also lost my turn signal and brake lights. Also My rt headlight is pretty dim. My hazards work but I got a a new flasher anyways still no change. I checked the ground on the headlight and the rt turn signal ground and they seemed fine.
I'm electrically challenged so I definitely have no clue what else to look for or how to test circuits and I'm kinda color blind so tracing wiring schematics is difficult.
I'm guessing it is some type of ground/earth problem but, Could it be a bad cricuit breaker? Any suggestions where to look? Is there a common circuit for these three lights? I've searched a bunch of threads.
Thanks in advance
Hydraulic switch Lights, Turns signals and brake lights Out.
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audiocontr
- Posts: 1868
- Joined: Fri May 01, 2009 1:30 pm
- Location: Buffalo NY
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undysworld
- Posts: 1776
- Joined: Fri Apr 16, 2004 8:08 am
- Location: Blue Mounds, WI
Mopar,
Some thoughts...
Did you lose all the locker lights, or only the light for the locker you fixed? If it's only the one, then I'd be checking the circuit at the slave cyl. area. If all went out, then I'd think power supply, so I'd check breakers first, as audio suggested.
I'd guess the headlight is only working in it's "park" light mode. These headlights have a hi and lo beam in addition to another bulb in there which works sort of like our parking lamps. It sounds like the hi/lo lamp is not on, again possibly due to a flipped breaker.
I can't remember where the breakers are listed, as to which does what, but I think it's in the owners manual.
I'm sure others will offer input, but I'll try and explain electric theory and troublshooting some. The truck is DC, which means the electricity flows similarly to water from a supply to a device and then back to the earth. Pinzes run on 24v DC. (Don't let the 12v batteries fool you, when they are hooked together, they supply 24v to run the truck.) Ignore the battery terminals which are used to tie the batteries together (one will be +, the other -). The terminals which remain are the ones which provide the 24v supply. The - terminal is attached directly to the truck's chassis (they call this a "chassis ground"). The + terminal is where the 24v power is drawn to feed devices (like motors, lights, etc.). Power flows from this + terminal, through breakers, switches, and devices and back to chassis ground.
This power is sent to various switches which are used to turn off the power. It is also sent through the breakers for protection, they will "break" in the event of too much power going through them. When the 24v is supplied to a motor or lamp, they will run when their other terminal gets connected to the chassis ground. (Many times this ground is accomplished by touching the device's metal frame to the truck's ground, like a bulb or a motor does).
If you use a voltmeter (or a 24v test lamp), you can ground the black lead (or clamp lead on a lamp) to the truck chassis (remember, it's the "-" part of the system), and touch the red lead (or lamp probe) to any terminal and the test device will register if there is 24v present.
In the case of a breaker which is working properly, you should find 24v present at both breaker terminals. This is showing that the 24v is coming to the breaker and passing through it, as it should. If you don't have 24v on both terminals, the breaker is open or defective.
In the case of a switch, you should find 24v on one terminal at all times (assuming truck is powered up), but 24v on the other terminal only when the switch is "on", but not when the switch is "off".
In the case of a light bulb (such as your lockers), the bulb will light only when there is 24v supplied to one bulb terminal and the bulb body is grounded, thus completing the circuit. Constant 24v is supplied to one terminal of the locker indicator bulbs, but then the ground goes through the switch down at the slave. You should have 24v present at the switch terminal, and when the switch gets depressed by the slave, it grounds the circuit lighting the lamp. So if you disconnect the wire at the slave and ground it, the lamp should light. If it does light, you may have a bad or misconnected locker switch (remember the connector within the switch cover plate). If you do not find 24v at that wire, you've got a problem in the power getting there, so start checking breakers or the ignition switch or a bad locker indicator lamp.
This post may be of no help to you, depending on how familiar you are with electricity. There's too much to be able to explain it all well here. It may be worth your while to get a book on basic automotive electronics. The same principals apply to the 24v Pinz system as the 12v car systems.
Some thoughts...
Did you lose all the locker lights, or only the light for the locker you fixed? If it's only the one, then I'd be checking the circuit at the slave cyl. area. If all went out, then I'd think power supply, so I'd check breakers first, as audio suggested.
I'd guess the headlight is only working in it's "park" light mode. These headlights have a hi and lo beam in addition to another bulb in there which works sort of like our parking lamps. It sounds like the hi/lo lamp is not on, again possibly due to a flipped breaker.
I can't remember where the breakers are listed, as to which does what, but I think it's in the owners manual.
I'm sure others will offer input, but I'll try and explain electric theory and troublshooting some. The truck is DC, which means the electricity flows similarly to water from a supply to a device and then back to the earth. Pinzes run on 24v DC. (Don't let the 12v batteries fool you, when they are hooked together, they supply 24v to run the truck.) Ignore the battery terminals which are used to tie the batteries together (one will be +, the other -). The terminals which remain are the ones which provide the 24v supply. The - terminal is attached directly to the truck's chassis (they call this a "chassis ground"). The + terminal is where the 24v power is drawn to feed devices (like motors, lights, etc.). Power flows from this + terminal, through breakers, switches, and devices and back to chassis ground.
This power is sent to various switches which are used to turn off the power. It is also sent through the breakers for protection, they will "break" in the event of too much power going through them. When the 24v is supplied to a motor or lamp, they will run when their other terminal gets connected to the chassis ground. (Many times this ground is accomplished by touching the device's metal frame to the truck's ground, like a bulb or a motor does).
If you use a voltmeter (or a 24v test lamp), you can ground the black lead (or clamp lead on a lamp) to the truck chassis (remember, it's the "-" part of the system), and touch the red lead (or lamp probe) to any terminal and the test device will register if there is 24v present.
In the case of a breaker which is working properly, you should find 24v present at both breaker terminals. This is showing that the 24v is coming to the breaker and passing through it, as it should. If you don't have 24v on both terminals, the breaker is open or defective.
In the case of a switch, you should find 24v on one terminal at all times (assuming truck is powered up), but 24v on the other terminal only when the switch is "on", but not when the switch is "off".
In the case of a light bulb (such as your lockers), the bulb will light only when there is 24v supplied to one bulb terminal and the bulb body is grounded, thus completing the circuit. Constant 24v is supplied to one terminal of the locker indicator bulbs, but then the ground goes through the switch down at the slave. You should have 24v present at the switch terminal, and when the switch gets depressed by the slave, it grounds the circuit lighting the lamp. So if you disconnect the wire at the slave and ground it, the lamp should light. If it does light, you may have a bad or misconnected locker switch (remember the connector within the switch cover plate). If you do not find 24v at that wire, you've got a problem in the power getting there, so start checking breakers or the ignition switch or a bad locker indicator lamp.
This post may be of no help to you, depending on how familiar you are with electricity. There's too much to be able to explain it all well here. It may be worth your while to get a book on basic automotive electronics. The same principals apply to the 24v Pinz system as the 12v car systems.
It starts and runs fine. Its all my locker lights. I tried pushing all the breakers up and down. I think it happened when I took it in the woods to try and shake the transfer case free. I drove down the road (not registered yet)with my flashers on (it got real hot and burned my hand) and I didn't notice the locker indicator lights as I had them disconnected as I was bleeding the hydraulics. It worked when I picked the truck up as that is how I knew it was stuck in 4x4. The signals worked then also. I don't know if the light housing may have shorted something bouncing around or I tore a wire or blew some kind of inline fusible link?but I'm pretty sure the outage of the 3 light sets is connected somehow. My horn works also.
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undysworld
- Posts: 1776
- Joined: Fri Apr 16, 2004 8:08 am
- Location: Blue Mounds, WI
Well, shooting off the hip here, I'd say the problem's not down at the locker slave then.
The breakers do occasionally go bad. Figure out which one runs the locker lights and test it as above. Or just test 'em all. You should find 24v on both terminals.
The fact that you've lost several functions makes me think that it could be a breaker, or a least power supply related.
Sorry to hear you're having such troubles, especially after just getting your truck. It can get pretty frustrating. Out of curiosity, where are you located? Near any of the Pinz servicers? Most of us must rely on either ourselves or on finding a local mechanic who's willing to work on Pinzgauers. If you're feeling totally at sea electrically, it might be time to find an old VW mechanic or the like.
The breakers do occasionally go bad. Figure out which one runs the locker lights and test it as above. Or just test 'em all. You should find 24v on both terminals.
The fact that you've lost several functions makes me think that it could be a breaker, or a least power supply related.
Sorry to hear you're having such troubles, especially after just getting your truck. It can get pretty frustrating. Out of curiosity, where are you located? Near any of the Pinz servicers? Most of us must rely on either ourselves or on finding a local mechanic who's willing to work on Pinzgauers. If you're feeling totally at sea electrically, it might be time to find an old VW mechanic or the like.
Circuit breakers
Here's a list of the the Circuit Breakers:
1. Left f & r parking lights, speedometer lamp, fuel gauge lamp
2. Right f & r parking lights
3. Left low beam headlight
4. Right low beam headlight
5. Left high beam headlight
6. Right high beam headlight
7. Front blackout lamp – optional
8. Rear blackout lights – optional (pink wire)
9. Headlight high beams
10. Horn, idle cutoff solenoids, blower, wipers
11. Emergency flashers, map light, (heater indicator – optional)
12. Headlight relay, emergency flasher relay, diff/4x4 indicators
I would check for current on #12 as Paul U. previously suggested.
Hope this helps.
Paul C.
1. Left f & r parking lights, speedometer lamp, fuel gauge lamp
2. Right f & r parking lights
3. Left low beam headlight
4. Right low beam headlight
5. Left high beam headlight
6. Right high beam headlight
7. Front blackout lamp – optional
8. Rear blackout lights – optional (pink wire)
9. Headlight high beams
10. Horn, idle cutoff solenoids, blower, wipers
11. Emergency flashers, map light, (heater indicator – optional)
12. Headlight relay, emergency flasher relay, diff/4x4 indicators
I would check for current on #12 as Paul U. previously suggested.
Hope this helps.
Paul C.
Paul C.
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'73 Swiss 710M
'89 Puch 230GE
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'73 Swiss 710M
'89 Puch 230GE
Re: Circuit breakers
It kinda comes as expected when buying a used 1973 vehicle plus thats why I bargained on the vehicle expecting it would need some work as they always do.undysworld wrote: Sorry to hear you're having such troubles, especially after just getting your truck. It can get pretty frustrating. Out of curiosity, where are you located? Near any of the Pinz servicers? Most of us must rely on either ourselves or on finding a local mechanic who's willing to work on Pinzgauers. If you're feeling totally at sea electrically, it might be time to find an old VW mechanic or the like.
The Flasher module it gets very hot when its on for a whileedzz wrote:What burned your hand?mopar wrote: I drove down the road (not registered yet)with my flashers on (it got real hot and burned my hand) .
Ed
Perfect that sounds like a good candidate to start with. I'll give it a look tomorrow. Who carries circuit breakers? Looked at EI and couldn't find them.pcolette wrote:
I would check for current on #12 as Paul U. previously suggested.
Hope this helps.
Paul C.
Breakers
Don't know if EI has them but SAV does: http://www.pinzgauer.com/showdetails.ph ... 7101850760
Paul C.
_________
'73 Swiss 710M
'89 Puch 230GE
_________
'73 Swiss 710M
'89 Puch 230GE
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Jim LaGuardia
- Posts: 1704
- Joined: Wed Apr 14, 2004 3:42 pm
- Location: San Bernardino Ca
- Contact:
Well I finally got into the breakers(talk about tight space and difficult working areas) and tested it and I only had 24 V at one side on the #12. As I was at work in the breakers I notice some of the brass colored rivets falling out of some of the other breakers so I killed the power and tested the continuity of each one and they all checked out except the # 12 so I swapped it with the #6 and the lights are back working again. My operators manual from SAV must be based on the Austrian Pinz as it only describes fuses and the descriptions do not correspond to the breakers at all which is what caused me a bunch of confusion. Thanks for giving me the fuse list as mine correspond with what is posted here. still need to figure out the dim RT headlight it may have been a loose wire I found behind the breakers or just a bad bulb. I will figure it out when I get my new circuit breaker. which will be easier than finding a bad ground
