Got some really odd electrical demons

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Nomad
Posts: 93
Joined: Sun Jul 14, 2013 1:20 pm

Got some really odd electrical demons

Post by Nomad »

I must say some of these have baffled me a bit.

When I got the truck a month or so ago the LHS diesel tail lights, put on by me nearly 10yrs ago were not working. I figured I had bad bulbs but after opening up the tail lights no bad bulbs could be found. Regardless I picked up some that were as close of a match as I could find in my tiny town at Napa on a Saturday. Put them in and no change in the problems. I then started looking at the wires. Now the RHS which works fine or did work fine the wires seem to be in the right locations. The odd thing is the other side, LHS, the wires are different. For example, on the RHS the blue/green wire goes to the tail light (this is just an example I don't recall exactly the colors now) but on the LHS if hooked up this way it doesn't work at all. So I simply put my volt meter on the wires, identified them and plugged them into the correct locations. Ok that worked, kind of. What really gets me is if the blue/green works fine on one side and is in the right location why is it not the same on the other side? Are these wires not tied together and basically in parallel? So if there is power to the blue/green on the RHS and it all works fine why would there not be power to the blue green on the other side and instead there is power tot he yellow/white? I know the simple answer is that they are mixed up somewhere. I am just having a hard time thinking that is the problem since I did this work and it was fine years ago. Plus I am pretty sure the dude who owned this truck the last 8+yrs didn't mess with the tail lights at all. I know this because I had siliconed the covers way back when to keep water out and that was still in place and this "seal" had not been broken.

Now I have turn signals in the rear on both sides, brake lights, back up lights and running lights. All is well, except now when I turn on the headlights the RHS doesn't work at all! The same day I messed with this a new problem shows up. My overhead old school Warn driving lights are going whacky. I have two sets both on separate circuits. One set was randomly coming on. Switch is off, key is off but one set of overhead lights just comes on whenever. This never happened on the truck before until I messed witht he tail lights. To keep from killing my batts I simply unplugged the overhead lights giving me probs. If I pulled the switch and then turned it off the lights would go out but 10 minutes later they would randomly come on all by themselves! Weird.

As far as the tail lights. I read the EI walk through and that is all fine and dandy except I have an Austrian truck and I have no orange wires behind my flasher unit! I really do not recall how I hooked these up nearly 10yrs ago but I do know it wasn't hard and they worked great until I sold the truck. I did buy some stock TD tail light bulbs from Scott but have not installed them yet. The Napa ones are very similar but do have some different voltage ratings, albeit still 24v.

Here is another odd one and maybe I am just a noob and they are supposed to be this way, I could see that for safety reasons. Any ways, with the headlights on all the 4wd & locker lights don't work. Turn off the headlights and they come on fine. Turn on the headlights and the lights go out. Is this normal?

Lastly, when I use a turn signal the trail light indicator in the dash lights up. I don't think this is normal but maybe it is?? I did open up the trailer light junction box at the back of the truck and all seems well, not corroded, dirty or any of that.

I do have some shoddy wiring under the dash. Crappy splices, not done by me but by a famous Pinz mechanic!! :roll: Crappy stuff with crappy electrical tape over the crappy connections. This I plan to remedy with my soldering kit and some shrink wrap. I don't see this as being my problems but maybe it is?

Cheers
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eToothpaste
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Location: Fruita, CO

Re: Got some really odd electrical demons

Post by eToothpaste »

If the wiring diagram that came with my truck is correct, then the left and right tail lights are on different colour wires (gray for one, black for the other). I think they are different circuit breakers so if one trips, you still have the other tail light (I assume).

There are some wires that ARE different colours even though they are technically on the same conductor (most notably the Brake indicator has one color from the brake switch and one from the low fluid level switch).

For most of these problems I would throw a dollar at bad grounds ... somewhere. Also, definitely the bad connections under the dash! Intermittent shorts to other circuits can be REALLY strange and even harder to troubleshoot.

I suggest fixing the bad connection you can find first. Then start checking grounds. Then get an electrical grease to protect every electrical connector you come across from now on. Something like No-Ox-Id A-Special, which is what I swear by. http://www.sanchem.com/aSpecialE.html If you buy direct from Sanchem it is about $6 for literally a couple lifetimes worth of grease.

_____
Colour = color? I think my browser has a British dictionary...
Matt

1972 710m
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CentAr712
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Re: Got some really odd electrical demons

Post by CentAr712 »

Just be sure that your wiring diagram is the Swiss one. I happen to have both, one that came with the truck and one came with an English language owners manual I bought. I randomly grabbed one when I installed new tail-lights and that's when I realized that the one that came with the owners manual I bought was for an Austrian truck. There are some differences in the wiring between the Swiss and Austrian models.
Chris.
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'76 712M Rapier Cargo (Swiss), For Sale
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CentAr712
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Re: Got some really odd electrical demons

Post by CentAr712 »

Nomad,
I've never installed the TD tail-lights so I don't know how they are set up, but keep this in mind, the brake & turn signal functions are combined and need their own bulb and they can't be combined with the tail-lights the way they are in American cars. If you have it wired in a way that your tail-lights are also functioning as brake or turn signals, it's not wired right. I learned the hard way that if you have tail-lights that won't work with the Pinz, like ones that use dual-filament bulbs, you can actually make them work by mistake, but then you get all sort of electrical gremlins like I did. I was having all the same electrical gremlins like you describe until I really studied the wiring diagram better and thought about it enough to realize it was all my fault in reality. My solution was simple, I just bought another set of tail-lights that were already being used on Pinz's, my mistake was thinking that I could just use any tail light that happens to take 24v bulbs.

I would assume that since the TD tail-lights are a factory item that they should work fine; I would just double check how you have it wired and also check to be sure that you have a good solid ground. I was having other strange issues that turned out to be a bad ground connection caused by paint, and old dirt, etc.

Chris.
Chris.
https://www.supanik.com/pinz
'76 712M Rapier Cargo (Swiss), For Sale
'83 MB W460 280GE G-Wagen, For Sale
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Jimm391730
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Re: Got some really odd electrical demons

Post by Jimm391730 »

Another thing to keep in mind is that most unused Pinz wires for lights (as in "unused" when the turn signal is NOT flashing) connect to GROUND through the switch(s); in American auto wiring these are usually open (not connected to ground or positive). You can't just hook the turn signal wire and brake switch wire to the same bulb or you will be popin' breakers and makin' spitzensparken!
Jim M.
712W and 710M
Nomad
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Joined: Sun Jul 14, 2013 1:20 pm

Re: Got some really odd electrical demons

Post by Nomad »

Thank you for the information, I think the info you guys gave me will help solve the riddles a lot. I have not messed with the wiring yet, been focusing on other things lately.

My truck is Austrian, the wiring diagrams I have are for Swiss trucks. I have gotten some stock TD bulbs now from Scott, perhaps the Napa bulbs I got are part of the problems? Any ways, I will get back to messing with the wiring soon, just got some bigger fish to fry right now on the truck.

Cheers
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