My latest project - Disc Brakes for a 710/712

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TechMOGogy
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Re: My latest project - Disc Brakes for a 710/712

Post by TechMOGogy » Fri Jul 28, 2017 1:59 pm

Garrycol wrote:I take it that wheel adaptors/spacer are legal in the US - unfortunately in Aust they are completely illegal except if a OEM fitment. Get caught with them here and your vehicle has to be towed home.
Easily fixed with a custom rim!
72 Pathfinder | 75 710M 2.7i | 94 350GDT | 96 350GDT Worker

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Haf-e
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Re: My latest project - Disc Brakes for a 710/712

Post by Haf-e » Fri Jul 28, 2017 5:47 pm

Those have to be evaluated by an engineer also in Australia I hear...
Haf-e

1971 Pinzgauer 710M

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Disc Brake Conversion Kits for 710 and 712 Pinzgauers
www.klugewerks.com

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Garrycol
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Re: My latest project - Disc Brakes for a 710/712

Post by Garrycol » Fri Jul 28, 2017 9:19 pm

Yes full engineering of the brakes are technically required but a professional job like you have done would not be questioned and most authorities would just not know what a Pinz is and what they came with.

Spacers are a different matter but we can legally change track by up to 50mm (some States only 25mm) so this would allow an offset change to the wheels so no engineering needed - here banding wheels is not legal but removing the wheel centre and rewelding at a different offset is legal and not all that expensive.

Nice looking mod :-)

Garry
1973 Haflinger AP700
1977 Landrover FC 101
2007 Range Rover Sport TDV6
1971 Jaguar Series 3 E-Type Conv
1957 Landrover 88" Station Wagon
1957 Landrover 88"

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Profpinz
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Re: My latest project - Disc Brakes for a 710/712

Post by Profpinz » Sat Jul 29, 2017 12:49 am

here banding wheels is not legal but removing the wheel centre and rewelding at a different offset is legal and ndxot all that expensive.
Tell me about it, I've just been through all that with the authorities.....Pinzgauer wheels are a pain to change as the material is so thick that the centre won't fit in most off the shelf (mainly ROH) rims in Aus.
The original rims are 6mm thick, ROH etc are generally 3mm, so there's approx 6mm slack when you fit the centre.
I had a guy machine one where he left part of the original rim and weld in place to make up the 3mm, but then the wheel is illegal as you can't have two circular welds.....only one.
Eventually found some US rims that were the correct thickness.

Additionally, an interesting point is that "technically" all widened rims used if a Haflinger was fitted with the optional Diamond Tread Tyres by Haflinger Sales and Service, are illegal.....as they are banded. :evil: :oops: :cry:

....sorry, didn't mean to hijack the thread!
Peter

1974, 712 6X6 Pinzgauer
1983, 710-1.6 4X4 Pinzgauer
1997, 718 6X6 Pinzgauer (in pieces)
1971, 700 Haflinger
1974, 703 LWB Haflinger
2001, Range Rover

http://www.ozpinz.com

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Garrycol
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Re: My latest project - Disc Brakes for a 710/712

Post by Garrycol » Sat Jul 29, 2017 5:00 am

Profpinz wrote:Additionally, an interesting point is that "technically" all widened rims used if a Haflinger was fitted with the optional Diamond Tread Tyres by Haflinger Sales and Service, are illegal.....as they are banded. :evil: :oops: :cry:
Yes but technically done by the manufacturer so is legal - but if a private person does the same after purchase is not legal.
1973 Haflinger AP700
1977 Landrover FC 101
2007 Range Rover Sport TDV6
1971 Jaguar Series 3 E-Type Conv
1957 Landrover 88" Station Wagon
1957 Landrover 88"

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Haf-e
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Re: My latest project - Disc Brakes for a 710/712

Post by Haf-e » Mon Jul 31, 2017 1:25 pm

Here is a photo of the proportioning valve installed. It is working well. I can lock up the front brakes on without locking the rear brakes on the lowest setting. Will need to test it more on a variety of conditions to figure out the best settings.

I used a version which Wilwood offers with m10 bubble flares - that makes the plumbing much easier since that is what the master cylinder actually uses. I used a SS flex line to go from the master to the valve but a hard line would also work. The existing brake line was bent a bit to allow connection of the valve using the original adapters with the residual pressure valve removed. Pretty easy install. Need to still fab a bracket to prevent vibration damage.
wilwood proportioning valve.jpg
wilwood proportioning valve.jpg (482.71 KiB) Viewed 1202 times
Haf-e

1971 Pinzgauer 710M

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Disc Brake Conversion Kits for 710 and 712 Pinzgauers
www.klugewerks.com

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Haf-e
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Re: My latest project - Disc Brakes for a 710/712

Post by Haf-e » Mon Jul 31, 2017 1:35 pm

Profpinz wrote: The original rims are 6mm thick
I did a quick measurement on a sprinter rim metal and they appear to be the same 6mm thickness. I know that the sprinter, transit and pinzgauer wheels all have very similar weights - about 30lbs / 14 kg each. The sprinter and Transit rims are rated for pretty heavy loads - my sprinter has a maximum rear axle rating of 4700 lbs - seems like that would make these rims appropriate for use on a Pinzgauer.
Last edited by Haf-e on Wed Dec 20, 2017 3:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Haf-e

1971 Pinzgauer 710M

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Disc Brake Conversion Kits for 710 and 712 Pinzgauers
www.klugewerks.com

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Haf-e
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Re: My latest project - Disc Brakes for a 710/712

Post by Haf-e » Mon Jul 31, 2017 3:25 pm

My favorite rim for the Pinzgauer would be the MJ Lee "Mach 5" rim out of the UK - but I don't think they are available any more. I know of only two sets which made it state side. They used their own steel rim with a rolled edge forming a tube on the inside and outside beads. Did not allow use of clip on weights - so balancing beads where required.
Last edited by Haf-e on Tue Aug 08, 2017 11:19 am, edited 2 times in total.
Haf-e

1971 Pinzgauer 710M

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Disc Brake Conversion Kits for 710 and 712 Pinzgauers
www.klugewerks.com

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Garrycol
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Re: My latest project - Disc Brakes for a 710/712

Post by Garrycol » Mon Jul 31, 2017 9:27 pm

Thats odd as I have Mach 5 rims have normal rims not those round rims.

But while the company that made the rims are still in business - I believe in another form, I had heard that they no longer make the Mach 5 rims though Landrover parts sellers like Paddocks in the UK are still selling them (and getting them made) http://www.paddockspares.com/land-rover ... lloys.html but probably not a lot of use for a Pinz but does highlight they are still being made somewhere. So maybe Mach 5 wheels with a normal style rim could be found.

Here is a pic of my 101 with them on and you can see the shiny weights. The 101 does not have a LR stud pattern but has the Nato 6 stud pattern common to smaller older Mogs.
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Garry
1973 Haflinger AP700
1977 Landrover FC 101
2007 Range Rover Sport TDV6
1971 Jaguar Series 3 E-Type Conv
1957 Landrover 88" Station Wagon
1957 Landrover 88"

Rookie
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Re: My latest project - Disc Brakes for a 710/712

Post by Rookie » Tue Aug 01, 2017 7:22 pm

I think that is awesome i would love disc braks up front i have 712 and it brakes pretty good but front disc brakes would be great do u have a price in mind for just the front axle for disc brakes

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Haf-e
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Re: My latest project - Disc Brakes for a 710/712

Post by Haf-e » Wed Aug 02, 2017 11:22 am

Sure - converting just the front axle (with the addition of the proportioning valve for the rear brakes) seems like it would be feasible. You'd also end up with a spare set of drums and brake shoes for the rears once you were done!

The only issue I see is that the front wheels would either need to be different from the rears or all seven wheels would need to be replaced. There are new Euro Ford Transit 16 inch wheels available from a German Ebay seller "UK TunerShop" which sells them for about $90 each including shipping or similar deals can be found on the domestic Ford Transit wheels which are slightly different. I am hoping to check the fit of the Transit wheels soon to see if it can be done with just a wheel spacer and longer lug bolts instead of the full wheel adapter required for using the Sprinter wheels.

There is another conversion being done right now of a 712 with just the front axle - so that will provide some valuable information once it is complete. It already has the CEPEK hummer type wheels so that will be a difference though.
Haf-e

1971 Pinzgauer 710M

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Disc Brake Conversion Kits for 710 and 712 Pinzgauers
www.klugewerks.com

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Haf-e
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Re: My latest project - Disc Brakes for a 710/712

Post by Haf-e » Wed Aug 02, 2017 11:35 am

I did some estimation for the cost of just the raw metal brackets, required mounting hardware and the custom disc rotors - the purchaser would need to provide all of the calipers, plumbing parts and adapters as well as any wheel spacer / adapter required depending on what wheels are used. The cost would be the same for a front or rear axle this way - it uses all the same parts - just one caliper on the rear versus dual calipers on the front.

So I think it could be offered for around $500 which would include a $25 donation to the Real4x4 website as well - gotta keep this forum online! This is assuming low volume (as in one or two sets fabricated at a time) - the cost would go down to $400 if it was possible to do it at higher volumes such as 10 sets at a time.

Thoughts?
Haf-e

1971 Pinzgauer 710M

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Disc Brake Conversion Kits for 710 and 712 Pinzgauers
www.klugewerks.com

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Jimm391730
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Re: My latest project - Disc Brakes for a 710/712

Post by Jimm391730 » Wed Aug 02, 2017 3:24 pm

Can you give us the dimensional issue with the stock rims? I have widened (8") rims that were welded onto the original Pinz wheel center, I'm wondering if they will clear the disk conversion parts, or not... Is there a measurement that can be done to determine if my rims will clear?
Jim M.
712W and 710M

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Haf-e
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Re: My latest project - Disc Brakes for a 710/712

Post by Haf-e » Wed Aug 02, 2017 3:51 pm

Sure - the rotor is 11.6 inches in diameter, and the caliper extends "radially" about 1 inch - so the overall diameter ends up being about 13.5 inches. The caliper extends out forward and backwards about 1.7 inches in the "axial" direction.

My memory of the Pinzgauer stock wheel is that it is about 12.6 inches in diameter where the welds are. The Sprinter rim I used is about 13.75 inches inside clearance diameter.
Haf-e

1971 Pinzgauer 710M

Image
Disc Brake Conversion Kits for 710 and 712 Pinzgauers
www.klugewerks.com

Brady 712k
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Re: My latest project - Disc Brakes for a 710/712

Post by Brady 712k » Mon Aug 07, 2017 11:41 pm

I just bought 7 rims to go on my Pinzgauer 712k from a 2014 Ford Transit. If you're telling me this disc brake conversion will work with those rims I'm ready to send you money to have that kit come my way!

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