Wheels for tubeless tires...

Issues with shocks/springs, tires, steering box, stopping, etc.
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Rifleman
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Wheels for tubeless tires...

Post by Rifleman »

I have just purchased some 267/75 BFG MT KM2s to replace the all terrains that came on my recently acquired 710M. The tires are not in yet but now I am thinking about wheel options. Looking at the factory wheels it is clear they are not optimal for bead seal on a tubeless tire set-up.

Are there any new options lately? I see some discussion of the Cepek aluminum wheels from some 2011 post.

I also found on Coldwar Remarketings site they offer a widened steel wheel built with original centers and new 8" wide tubeless rims. Does anyone have experience with these? They seem to be a lot money for a basic wheel, but I can certainly understand the expense of the re-manufacturing process.

Widened wheels pictured in the "after" photos.

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'75 710M
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David Dunn
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Re: Wheels for tubeless tires...

Post by David Dunn »

A long long time ago on a long since sold 710M :wink: , I ran 265/75s on the stock rims. Tires were fine, except if you lower the tire pressure below 18 psi. Once,at 15 psi, I rolled a front tire off the bead on a quick hard turn.
.
The Trojan Horse... the 1st Pinz used to covertly carry troops into battle .




ATL Pinzgauer XM 718K TUM(HD) 6x6 FFR (aka The Green Grail)
undysworld
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Re: Wheels for tubeless tires...

Post by undysworld »

Yup. Most of us run tubeless radials on the original rims with little ill effect.

I bought my truck from Patrick at CWR, and he's always done right by me. But you ought to do a search on this forum, because not everybody was so satisfied...

Likely just about any good wheel repair shop (not tire dealer) could re-hoop your wheel centers, I'd think.
krick3tt
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Re: Wheels for tubeless tires...

Post by krick3tt »

When I ran 33's I had tubes and balancing beads. Switched them out for 31's, a bit closer to stock size (i think) at least now I can get into the garage. I have one tire that loses air. I fill it to 45 psi
and it goes down to 20 psi. Annoying. I now use it for the spare, at least I know there is at least 20 psi in there. I think it might be the rim. Maybe I dented it in the past on some obstacle in the desert.
When I had a tire shop mount the new tire they asked if I wanted to have them put sealer on the rim to keep air in the tire. Had not heard of this operation so I opted not to have them do it.
Thought it might be an issue if I needed to perform a field repair.
Any one heard of this operation before? If so does it work?
Any man who thinks he can be happy and prosperous by letting the government take care of him:
better take a closer look at the American Indian.---Henry Ford
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David Dunn
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Re: Wheels for tubeless tires...

Post by David Dunn »

Morris
This was common on old LRs. Since the rim were made with tubes in mind, it wasn't a issues, and all militaries were using tubes anyway.
The civilian market started using tubeless and the imperfections in manufacturing became an issue and people put heavy coats of paint on the inside of the rim to seal them.... the Pinz rim is no different. :wink:
.
The Trojan Horse... the 1st Pinz used to covertly carry troops into battle .




ATL Pinzgauer XM 718K TUM(HD) 6x6 FFR (aka The Green Grail)
krick3tt
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Re: Wheels for tubeless tires...

Post by krick3tt »

Thanks David. A heavy coat of paint might be a good idea. I had cleaned the rims and only painted the outside that shows.
I had a very difficult time even getting the tubes for the 33's, I had not even thought about tubes for the smaller diameter tires.
Any man who thinks he can be happy and prosperous by letting the government take care of him:
better take a closer look at the American Indian.---Henry Ford
krick3tt
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Re: Wheels for tubeless tires...

Post by krick3tt »

:lol:
Any man who thinks he can be happy and prosperous by letting the government take care of him:
better take a closer look at the American Indian.---Henry Ford
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Haf-e
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Re: Wheels for tubeless tires...

Post by Haf-e »

The European Ford Transit vans use a wheel that is interchangeable with the Pinzgauer's wheels - no idea yet if the US version of the Ford Transit that is about to be released in a few months (?) will use that same rim - if it does it might be a great option for swapping out for a more modern wheel with real safety beads. I prefer the look of the original wheels over the ones I seen from the fords though - but they look like they have a little less backspacing which would be good for those running taller wheels like 33" to move the contact patch of the tire back to the correct point.

I've used tubeless tires for years - and I have lost tires on the front due to too low of air pressure and lots of side force when turning many times - once I lost two tires on the same trip - so keep the pressure on the front wheels to at about 18 PSI. I've started carrying two spares also... I've considered converting my rims to beadlocks with one of the weld on kits too or buying a set of the Staun internal bead lock tubes.
Haf-e

1971 Pinzgauer 710M

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Disc Brake Conversion Kits for 710 and 712 Pinzgauers
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Haf-e
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Re: Wheels for tubeless tires...

Post by Haf-e »

Should have also mentioned the beadlock wheels offered by "Trail Ready" which were ordered by a forum member "CompuNerdy" - they look really nice and very strong. They also have non-beadlock wheels as well.

http://www.trbeadlocks.com/
Haf-e

1971 Pinzgauer 710M

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Disc Brake Conversion Kits for 710 and 712 Pinzgauers
www.klugewerks.com
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edzz
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Re: Wheels for tubeless tires...

Post by edzz »

I have been running BF Goodrich Mud-Terrain TA KM2 255/85/16 Load Range E with no tubes for over 4 years. I've never had any issues, I don't usually run below about 15 - 20 psi for what it's worth. I am not as hard on my truck off-road as many so you may not have the same luck.

I'm guessing that you are new to the Pinzgauer and as such I would suggest not jumping into a lot of modifications before you have had time to find what is really needed for your uses.

Typically the modifications that seem to be the most universal with Pinz owners are, replacing the military tires with any decent off-road tire with out going overly large, replacing the tempered glass windshield with modern safety glass if it hasn't been done yet and "upgrading" the ignition system.

:)
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Pinz710m2

Re: Wheels for tubeless tires...

Post by Pinz710m2 »

Having just been through the decision making process, I can narrow it down for you.

There are really only two definite options: 1. Use the existing wheels and have them
modified or "stretched" so that todays' tires will fit. 2. Tom Cepek at GT makes
Pinzgauer-specific wheels (full 7 inch offset with proper lug pattern, etc.) but it's very
pricey, but super nice if you can afford it. (I went that route)

Everything else seems like an exercise in compromise. For example, the Trail Ready
wheels will fit, but they have a 6 inch offset. It makes them stick out about an inch more
than I think they should. But that might be okay for you. There's a company that will cut
your old wheels up and insert the center into the wheel of your choice, but again, this is a
compromise. I found a few custom wheel makers, but again, they were pretty expensive
for a set of steel wheels.

Do what you think works best for your driving purposes and budget.
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Jimm391730
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Re: Wheels for tubeless tires...

Post by Jimm391730 »

As has been said, most tires work reasonably well on the stock wheels. They do not have the "safety bead" which is a rib that helps to hold the tire bead in place on the rim; this is common in modern wheels in case of a blowout or you end up driving at speed with no air pressure and helps to hold the tire on the rim. Frankly, in my almost million miles of driving, I've never had this happen and while the safety bead might improve things I'd be more worried about other aspects! So I'm not all that worried about using the stock rims. I've yet to have one that didn't hold air as it should with tubeless tires.

I did get a good deal on 8" wide steel rims welded to the stock Pinz wheel center and use them on my 712. With the same backspacing as stock, they stick out 1-1/2" wider on each side for a 3" wider track. This made the stability feel much better and I like them for that reason (and I feel that a wider track always looks better, within reason). They came with 295/75 BFG AT tires which were a BITCH to steer because of the wide tread. I suppose if I regularly needed flotation for sand they would have been worthwhile but I've since gone back to more stock sized 265/75 on these wide wheels and the same sized tire on my 710 with stock wheels with no regrets.

And while some have been concerned about wheel bearings taking a beating with bigger offsets, I've yet to hear that anyone has had a problem. With bearings rated for the weight a Pinz is rated to I don't think they are even beginning to work hard.

I have decided that tubed tires are NOT the way to go; there is no easy way to fix simple punctures on the trail. Years ago (when I still had the tubed Maloyas) someone had spiked the trail to Saline Valley with roofing nails. I got a flat on the way in and changed to the spare. Then I got another flat on the way out and (luckily) was with another Pinz who loaned me their spare. I did my part and picked up two of the nails but was determined never to run tubes again. At least with tubeless I can stuff a plug in, pump some air, and get moving again, often without even jacking up the truck.
Jim M.
712W and 710M
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