Winch Info

[bdelaporte]

I have a Warn 24v Severe Duty 18k Winch that I am considering mounting on my 712 AMB-S. It weighs in a 175lbs as it is currently set up with 1/2"x75' EIPS (steel cable) and roller fairhead. I am afraid that it may be too much weight hanging off the front of the vehicle (front end sag) especially when I add a nice tubular bumper set up.

I have looked through many of the photos and specs of the other Pinzgauer owners and it seems that most perople running winches have 8k-10k models. Are most running the smaller models because of front end weight? A typical 8k-10k Warn with steel cable will weigh in at 85-95 lbs?

As I understand the rule-of-thumb minimum for winch selection is to take your GVW (Gross Vehicle Weight) and multiply it by 1.5. My Pinzgauer AMB-S 712 weighs approx 5500 lbs and has a cargo capacity of approximately 3000 lbs. GVW is then approx 8500 lbs

Based upon the figures above, I would be looking at a winch with a minimum pulling power of 12750 lbs. The 18k is quite a bit more than that but I suspect more is better than not enough as long as the weight does not get carried away.

I can cut weight on my 18k by changing out the EIPS to a synthetic rope and the roller fairhead to an aluminum hawse type. This will save approx 65 lbs and make the overall weight in the range of 110 lbs.

Long story (sorry) short, is the 175 lbs winch too heavy for my 712? If so does the extra cost of replacing the cable with rope, etc and saving 65 lbs make a big enough difference to making the 18k Warn usable?

Comments/suggestions are welcome.

[krick3tt]

What do you tie off to in Florida?

Perhaps save a few pounds by using a pulley and doubling the line to increase pulling power, that way use a lighter winch.
Maybe stronger front springs? I put a tubular bumper from EI and a 9500 lb winch and my springs went down 3/4''. Not a
problem as the pinz has such good clearance anyway.

The physics of power pulling elude me so I try not to worry about losing about an inch of clearance.

[bdelaporte]

What do you tie off to in Florida?

Perhaps save a few pounds by using a pulley and doubling the line to increase pulling power, that way use a lighter winch.
Maybe stronger front springs? I put a tubular bumper from EI and a 9500 lb winch and my springs went down 3/4''. Not a
problem as the pinz has such good clearance anyway.

The physics of power pulling elude me so I try not to worry about losing about an inch of clearance.

Trying to avoid selling the winch and buying a new smaller model because of the cost factor. As far as "tie off", it depends, I like to trail ride and there are lots of nasty mud pits. Always decent pine trees and such to attach to. Hopefully, the truck with take me on some fun adventures and having a winch is always a good thing to have along.

[czarthirteen]

Stick with the over powered winch you have, its really not that much of a pig.....but consider fabbing up a 2" reciever winch/hitch platform and build your front and rear supports and bumpers accordingly, this way.....providing you run your 24v leads front and rear....you can winch from the front and rear.....and stow the winch inboard or leave it at home when not necessary.

Definitely go for some high end synthetic rope to swap out the weight heavy wire rope that's on it and preemptively order a new set of front springs (never know when they'll come in handy but eventually, they will) and you should be all set.

[Jimm391730]

Absolutely, stay with the 18k winch (I'm jealous!). Just with the weight of the box and some stuff, your truck will weigh up at at least 7,000 lbs (I weighed mine once, came in at 6860 lbs and that was before winch, bumper, wide rims/tires, exoskeleton, and me, not counting "cargo"). My winch is only 9k but I have a couple of snatch blocks if needed. I did put in heavier front springs, they were worth it and they have handled the addtional stuff I've added without any signs of sag- I think the originals were just too weak and worn out by the time I got it.

You WILL need a serious bumper/mount for that beast, though. Put the winch (or fairlead) low, close to the pintle to keep the pull in line with the frame. Lessor winches have been know to reshape the cab, especially if the pull is downward. And I wouldn't attempt to move 175 lbs of winch around, nor mount it on receivers -- receivers are not intended for such pull forces, especially if you are pulling to the sides.

Synthetic rope will probably be well worth it, both for weight reduction and lack of the wire rope "gotchas" that inevitably develop. I've never used mine for my own extraction, only a few other vehicles but mostly its been used around the house for stump/tree extractions, lifting beams, moving logs, and other heavy stuff. I did get a wireless remote, if you can swing it you will find that it is exceptionally useful. Synthetic cable is next for me.

Lastly, remember that the 18k rating is only for the first layer of cable on the drum; you get less force as the layers increases.

[VinceAtReal4x4s]

Just my opinion, but I'm a fan of light weight when it comes to trail rigs whenever possible. I don't think you can put that much weight up front without a noticeable, negative effect on a Pinz. If it was a Mog or an F350, no problem, but it isn't. A smaller winch will save you 100lbs on the nose.

I'd consider what you are going to really do with it. It's a big 6x6 in Florida mud, mainly, and I'd bet you are usually going to be in situations where you don't need that much winch power. A 9000lb 24v (like a Superwinch) might get you out of just about anything. If you really need it, you can double-line your pull and at that point you are into the max range that any mount on a Pinz will hold up to anyway.

If you fully stall that 18K, or worse, double it for some reason and then stall, something Pinz-structure related will bend.

[GenevaPinz]

Hi all,

I decided to add my winch-related question to an existing thread, aptly named "winch info", instead of adding yet another thread, so I hope the OP won't mind.

So, I am about to install a 12'000lb 24v winch on a beautiful Fat Fabrications mount on the front of my Pinz (I promised Andre I will post pictures of the finished installation).

As I want to keep the solenoid inside the cab, this is one of the rare occasions when I have to drill my truck's sheetmetal. I hate to do it without a good reason, and I don't want to drill more than necessary.

The winch came with #2 gauge electric cables (standard on all winches that the manufacturer produces, which are mostly 12v winches), while some earlier posts mentionned #4 gauge as being sufficient (viewtopic.php?f=18&t=6536&hilit=winch+gauge), which makes sense with a higher voltage.

Before I buy cable and do the full installation, would you agree, in your experience, that #4 gauge safely does the trick?

[undysworld]

a 12'000lb 24v winch

came with #2 gauge electric cables

In this day and age of cutting costs wherever possible, I'd think that if the manufacturer sent their 24v winch out with 2 ga. cable there must be a reason for it.

I'd think your question might best be posed to the manufacturer.

[krick3tt]

Don't have to drill the metal. Use the drain hole in the footwell to pass the cable to the solenoid control.
I did that to keep the control inside.

http://s400.photobucket.com/user/mykric ... ort=3&o=34

http://s400.photobucket.com/user/mykric ... ort=3&o=50

[GenevaPinz]

Don't have to drill the metal. Use the drain hole in the footwell to pass the cable to the solenoid control.
I did that to keep the control inside.

http://s400.photobucket.com/user/mykric ... ort=3&o=34

http://s400.photobucket.com/user/mykric ... ort=3&o=50

Great tip, thanks!! I had seen these pics already, but never realised this was the footwell (I assumed it was one of the battery box access holes).

[GenevaPinz]

a 12'000lb 24v winch

came with #2 gauge electric cables

In this day and age of cutting costs wherever possible, I'd think that if the manufacturer sent their 24v winch out with 2 ga. cable there must be a reason for it.

I'd think your question might best be posed to the manufacturer.

You are right, I will ask the manufacturer.

Following -somehow- the same reasoning as you, I thought that with the manufacturer's sales being probably one 24v winch for fifty 12v ones, he would not bother with different cable gauge for 24v winches and would slap the same cables as for 12v, buying cable and terminals in bulk and saving on costs and inventory...

Whether I use the existing footwell drain or drill new holes, I'm trying to keep the cables' diameter as small as safely possible.

[GenevaPinz]

As a short update, the winch manufacturer did recommend keeping #2 gauge wire to remain on the safe side. Which is quite a lot of cable (1 from the batteries, 3 to the winch, plus the remote plug...).
Also, the footwell drain hole is not really an option as the shop that cured (most of) the rust of my truck a few years ago put some new sheetmetal on the passenger footwell, but didn't bother drilling the drain hole. With the larger diameter cable, I think more and more that I will keep the solenoid in the tunnel somewhere and just drill one hole for cables going to an in-cab remote... not sure yet, but I will post pics

[edzz]

May want to go to a wireless remote.

[krick3tt]

Avoid the one from the batteries by hooking directly to the inputs for the starter..there is 24V there.

[Andre]

Here's a bumper I built a few years ago for a Heavy duty winch.