Evan, that carrier is way to fast..
I'm sure this is the one http://www.screwballgraphics.com/images ... mail72.png
EFI tech stuff
Moderator: TechMOGogy
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Jimm391730
- Posts: 1456
- Joined: Wed Apr 14, 2004 10:58 pm
- Location: Idyllwild, CA
Full Sequential EFI
OK, now Jim L. has the only 710M with full sequential fuel injection, now thanks to his help he has to share that moniker with my 712W. Jim did the conversion to full sequential to my truck today, it only took about an hour and a half of getting the right wires in the harness to fit the new coil packs and reprogram the system. It took remarkably little changes to the trims, and almost nothing else and it fired up on the first half rotation. Jim sure knows his stuff! I never expected it to be so trouble free.
So, after only driving it 30 miles so far (in the dark and rain at that) all I can say is WOW, everything that I noticed during that time is better -- easier starting, more power, more torque at high rpms, smoother running. Although all these changes were slight (only a few percent better than when it was running batch) they were enough to be a noticable improvement.
To set the record straight, this truck has Jim L's 2.7l with Arias pistons (slightly higher compression) and his cam grind, and the TD overdrive tranny, and is a 7500 pound vehicle with a "W" box (like an ambulance but with glass skylight windows in a raised roof), so keep these in mind as I describe our "test run": near Jim's house is a four lane paved road over quite a hill (several hundred feet high) and Jim uses this hill as a comparison spot. He says most stock trucks go up the steep side in "second" gear at high revs, but not much else (perhaps he means third gear, but the second used gear, first being too much of a granny?). We almost made it to the top in the TD tranny's forth gear (1:1, just like 5th in the stock tranny) but had to downshift one gear as we got close to the top. So we almost made it in what would have been high gear in a stock tranny! With the two uf us, all my normal gear in the truck, it weighs in between 7500 and 8000 lbs! Higher gear, more weight, I can't say how impressed I was!
The coil pack assembly he installed is the one in the pictures above. Very clean installation, short wires direct from coils to plugs, something like 8-12" long. The only thing I have left to add is the idle air control to help keep the idle even as the temps drop or load increases. The new software for the EMS computer is much better than the older version that I was using with the batch fire; all sorts of customizable parameters, gauges, indications, etc. are available on my laptop.
After spending several thousand on the initial EFI system, adding the slight addtional cost to go to full sequential was very much worth it. Although the batch fire is head and shoulders above even well tuned carbs, for this truck with this EFI system the sequential is a notch above that.
All I can say is that Jim L. really knows what he is doing with this system, wiring harness, parts needed, the value they provide, etc., etc., etc. No complaints from me! I can recommend his system highly. This recommendation is in no way attempting to discredit any other systems out there, only to say that I have been (and continue to be) very pleased with what he has done and his personal work and ethics.
Let's get some more EFI trucks on the road!
Jim Mettler
712W (with SEQUENTIAL EFI!!!) and carburated 710M
So, after only driving it 30 miles so far (in the dark and rain at that) all I can say is WOW, everything that I noticed during that time is better -- easier starting, more power, more torque at high rpms, smoother running. Although all these changes were slight (only a few percent better than when it was running batch) they were enough to be a noticable improvement.
To set the record straight, this truck has Jim L's 2.7l with Arias pistons (slightly higher compression) and his cam grind, and the TD overdrive tranny, and is a 7500 pound vehicle with a "W" box (like an ambulance but with glass skylight windows in a raised roof), so keep these in mind as I describe our "test run": near Jim's house is a four lane paved road over quite a hill (several hundred feet high) and Jim uses this hill as a comparison spot. He says most stock trucks go up the steep side in "second" gear at high revs, but not much else (perhaps he means third gear, but the second used gear, first being too much of a granny?). We almost made it to the top in the TD tranny's forth gear (1:1, just like 5th in the stock tranny) but had to downshift one gear as we got close to the top. So we almost made it in what would have been high gear in a stock tranny! With the two uf us, all my normal gear in the truck, it weighs in between 7500 and 8000 lbs! Higher gear, more weight, I can't say how impressed I was!
The coil pack assembly he installed is the one in the pictures above. Very clean installation, short wires direct from coils to plugs, something like 8-12" long. The only thing I have left to add is the idle air control to help keep the idle even as the temps drop or load increases. The new software for the EMS computer is much better than the older version that I was using with the batch fire; all sorts of customizable parameters, gauges, indications, etc. are available on my laptop.
After spending several thousand on the initial EFI system, adding the slight addtional cost to go to full sequential was very much worth it. Although the batch fire is head and shoulders above even well tuned carbs, for this truck with this EFI system the sequential is a notch above that.
All I can say is that Jim L. really knows what he is doing with this system, wiring harness, parts needed, the value they provide, etc., etc., etc. No complaints from me! I can recommend his system highly. This recommendation is in no way attempting to discredit any other systems out there, only to say that I have been (and continue to be) very pleased with what he has done and his personal work and ethics.
Let's get some more EFI trucks on the road!
Jim Mettler
712W (with SEQUENTIAL EFI!!!) and carburated 710M
I had some trouble reconciling the claim that sequential works better (for Jim's setup) with the "conventional wisdom" that there should be no appreciable difference. Except possibly emissions.
What I realized is that conventional wisdom applies to conventional design. The Goatwerks plenum isn't a conventional design, in that the flow paths of the air/fuel mixture don't follow the model of a typical plenum/runner setup.
Thus I found I was able to resolve the conflict between what I thought I knew to be fact with what Jim was claiming. So, anyway, for those who were also wondering what to believe, hope this helps a little.
-Evan
What I realized is that conventional wisdom applies to conventional design. The Goatwerks plenum isn't a conventional design, in that the flow paths of the air/fuel mixture don't follow the model of a typical plenum/runner setup.
Thus I found I was able to resolve the conflict between what I thought I knew to be fact with what Jim was claiming. So, anyway, for those who were also wondering what to believe, hope this helps a little.
-Evan
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MASSIVE PINZ
- Posts: 234
- Joined: Tue Sep 13, 2005 11:30 pm
- Location: Cleveland Georgia
- Contact:
Tell me about it.. We have received 6 phone calls since the Pinz FI kits were shipped from people wanting the kits....EvanH wrote:Erik,
Did you tip the donkey a couple of carrots? Or were you slimed by the snail???
Please keep us posted with the installion details. MANY of us are awaiting the birth of Jake's EFI!!!
-Evan
I fulfilled my obligation to the 16 purchasers that committed to the system over 18 months ago and thats the end of the story...
I do have two different companies that deal with the Pinz market as a primary objective that have expressed interest in purchasing the plans , VE tables and recipes for the system to continue producing them. We'll see if that comes to pass.
So far everyone who has received the kit has been blown away with the completeness and application of what we have created. The real test will be when the kits get bolted on and people see the differences..
(BTW- it took 5 tanks of Argon and 7 pounds of filler rod to Tig weld all those plenums.. Its pure torture.)
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Jim LaGuardia
- Posts: 1704
- Joined: Wed Apr 14, 2004 3:42 pm
- Location: San Bernardino Ca
- Contact:
For info on those still looking at EFI here is a link http://204.200.199.239/images/fuel%20in ... ctions.pdf
I added some pictures and info for the DIY crowd.
I added some pictures and info for the DIY crowd.
Very interesting Jim! ... I've printed the article to read in detail in bed later tonight 
Peter
1974, 712 6X6 Pinzgauer
1983, 710-1.6 4X4 Pinzgauer
1997, 718 6X6 Pinzgauer (in pieces)
1971, 700 Haflinger
1974, 703 LWB Haflinger
2001, Range Rover
http://www.ozpinz.com
1974, 712 6X6 Pinzgauer
1983, 710-1.6 4X4 Pinzgauer
1997, 718 6X6 Pinzgauer (in pieces)
1971, 700 Haflinger
1974, 703 LWB Haflinger
2001, Range Rover
http://www.ozpinz.com
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MASSIVE PINZ
- Posts: 234
- Joined: Tue Sep 13, 2005 11:30 pm
- Location: Cleveland Georgia
- Contact:
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Jimm391730
- Posts: 1456
- Joined: Wed Apr 14, 2004 10:58 pm
- Location: Idyllwild, CA
OK, here's my two week and several hundred mile followup:
Sequential injection and the new sequential distributorless ignition have improved or equal performance in every aspect so far. In most cases it is only a slight improvement over the batch injection and waste spark system I had before, but one VERY noticable difference is in cold start up torque - I have a very steep driveway, close to 25% grade. Before I would have to let the truck warm up for 1-2 minutes to have enough torque to negotiate this steep grade in cold weather, but now I can drive up it within only a few seconds of cold (high 30's) start. Feels like almost full warmed up torque is available right away. Warm torque off idle feels 10-20% better, too.
With only 1+ tank of gas through it I can only say that my mileage is the same as before; perhaps after I tweak the fuel map further it might go up a few percent. Right now I'm running fairly rich throoughout most of the driving range (12.2-12.8 lambda) but the truck seems to like it that rich. I'll have to see if leaning it out towards 13-14 gains any improvement in MPG or decrease in driveability.
I now realize that I can't hang all of this change on just the sequential EFI since the spark system changed at the same time, but I don't think the spark was "poor" before so I don't think the spark improved things as much as the sequential injection did.
Anybody been busy and installed Jake's kit yet? We are all curious how much improvement you get too!
Jim Mettler
712W and 710M
Sequential injection and the new sequential distributorless ignition have improved or equal performance in every aspect so far. In most cases it is only a slight improvement over the batch injection and waste spark system I had before, but one VERY noticable difference is in cold start up torque - I have a very steep driveway, close to 25% grade. Before I would have to let the truck warm up for 1-2 minutes to have enough torque to negotiate this steep grade in cold weather, but now I can drive up it within only a few seconds of cold (high 30's) start. Feels like almost full warmed up torque is available right away. Warm torque off idle feels 10-20% better, too.
With only 1+ tank of gas through it I can only say that my mileage is the same as before; perhaps after I tweak the fuel map further it might go up a few percent. Right now I'm running fairly rich throoughout most of the driving range (12.2-12.8 lambda) but the truck seems to like it that rich. I'll have to see if leaning it out towards 13-14 gains any improvement in MPG or decrease in driveability.
I now realize that I can't hang all of this change on just the sequential EFI since the spark system changed at the same time, but I don't think the spark was "poor" before so I don't think the spark improved things as much as the sequential injection did.
Anybody been busy and installed Jake's kit yet? We are all curious how much improvement you get too!
Jim Mettler
712W and 710M
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MASSIVE PINZ
- Posts: 234
- Joined: Tue Sep 13, 2005 11:30 pm
- Location: Cleveland Georgia
- Contact: