No brake lights. Creative way to replace with new switch?

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audiocontr
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No brake lights. Creative way to replace with new switch?

Post by audiocontr » Wed Jul 01, 2009 2:56 pm

Ive read the heart and knuckle ache it takes to replace the stock switch. I was thinking of using some sort of contact switch. Maybe on the bump stop at the top of the break. Basically designed so that as soon as the pedal does NOT cause the pin to make contact, the lights turn on.

Any other ideas?

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Jim LaGuardia
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Post by Jim LaGuardia » Wed Jul 01, 2009 7:11 pm

It is a very easy job to replace the factory switch, I can usually do one in less than 20min with no bleeding needed.
Why re-invent the wheel?
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Pinz Enthusiast
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Post by Pinz Enthusiast » Wed Jul 01, 2009 11:00 pm

While Jim is totally right on as usual, I did reinvent the wheel, after installing 3 different factory brake switches, I got tired of the brake lights not comming on unless I pounded the pedal into the floor, so I got a contact switch and fabed up a small bracket and mounted it to the pedal mounting assembly, ( I do not have any pic's at the moment as the truck is up at my motorhome, but will shoot a few if anybody is interested this weekend) The switch works great and I can apply "soft" pedal and still have my brake lights work.
Eric
Anaheim Hills, Ca
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audiocontr
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Post by audiocontr » Thu Jul 02, 2009 7:22 am

Thanks to both for your answer. The slight braking brake lights are very important here in commuter DC. I was unaware that a stock switch turned on deep into the pedal travel. Could you please send me some photos of your creative switch?

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ka
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Post by ka » Thu Jul 02, 2009 4:35 pm

i can send you pix of my limit switch type work-around. it's been working gr8 but it was done in a hurry with junk i found in my garage. at the same time i ordered appropriate hardware from mcmaster that will someday make it into the pinz. i'll find those part numbers for you when i get out from under the current emergencies (asap).
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audiocontr
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Post by audiocontr » Sat Jul 04, 2009 2:49 pm

Well i take it back. I do have brake lights they just dont come on until half way into the brake action. Much deeper than the brakes actually need to engage. How can I set the switch so it lights up earlier?

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Jimm391730
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Post by Jimm391730 » Sun Jul 05, 2009 4:48 pm

How can I set the switch so it lights up earlier?
The factory set up is a pressure switch; it is not ajustable. If you don't like how much pressure it takes to trip it you should try a new switch. I had to do this on my 710.

Jim M.
712W and 710M

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ka
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Post by ka » Sun Jul 05, 2009 8:28 pm

my new switch is completely adjustable, very simple and i just used parts i found lying around. when i re-do it right it will be bomber as well. so why didn't pinzgauer do a better job there? i used to wonder about those ppl, now i just eliminate their failures by being a better designer, as required, whenever possible. this one is a no-brainer.
1973 710m
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David Dunn
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Post by David Dunn » Sun Jul 05, 2009 9:41 pm

The no brainer is to leave the original pressure switch alone! There is nothing wrong with the system. These trucks are over 30 years old, and a switch will sometime fail.... no big deal. Like any hydraulic system, crud collects, and a flush of the lines will not clean the crud that has collected into the port that the pressure switch is screwed into ( at least not without pulling the switch during the flush). Replacing a "crudded up" pressure switch without cleaning the port only gives the new switch a reduced life until the crud packs itself into the new switch. The crud also increases the pressure need to activate the switch until the crud blocks it beyond activation, or release.

The pressure activated brake light switches have been around forever, and have worked extremely well. I have had newer vehicles with pedal activated brake lamps that the switch has gone bad a couple of times and out of adjustment even more times ( and by no fault of mine) in one.

If you're a competent DIYer, you can change the switch out to a mechanical pedal activated switch, but why? you are not solving a possible crud built up in the master cylinder.
I have seen the handy work of DIYers that thought their IQ was higher than the number of digits they had... They had made a mess of the electrical system on the Pinz.

Rather than thinking you are smarter than an engineer, just replace the switch so when /if you sell it, or have someone else work on it, they don't need to reinvent the wheel.... I know Jim doesn't care to :wink:.... of course it means more money for him. :lol:

Dave
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Profpinz
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Post by Profpinz » Sun Jul 05, 2009 11:33 pm

I would have been happy to stick with the hydraulic switch except for one reason....When I rebuilt the vehicle I used silicon brake fluid throughout (all hydraulic lines).

As I had fabricated all new hydraulic lines and all the hoses, seals etc were new it was not such a big dilema, BUT it must be remembered that "some" seals/rubbers are susceptable to this fluid, so after talking to brake experts at PBR and ATE I determined which products were suitable and what was not.

No problems everything worked fine and all was rosy with the world!
... except that I kept losing brake lights.

Finally after much "hair pulling" it was deemed that the hydraulic switches must be susceptable to the silicon fluid and no matter which brand I tried they kept failing.
...so I fitted a mechanical switch and WALAH! ... that fixed the problem!

So unless your planning on running silicon in your brake lines, I'd stick with the hydraulic switch arrangement!
It's a neat, tidy arrangement that usually works quite reliably ... if you keep silicon away :roll:
Peter

1974, 712 6X6 Pinzgauer
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ka
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Post by ka » Mon Jul 06, 2009 1:12 pm

dave, my switching that switch to a mechanical limit switch activated by the pedal arm was initiated by my stock switch failing and being in such a difficult location to replace. my switch now works great and was easy to create. i'll judge myself on this one, by the outcome, kiss principle applied.

i won't be voting for pinzgauer's engineer on this design.

function junction. if pinzgauer designed a square wheel that i somehow acquired then i would definitely be redesigning that, with no thought about who's smarter than who, just trying to get all my things working the way i want them to, with no regard for how pinzgauer wanted them to. i understand errors all too well and cast no blame, but definitely independently evaluate. pinzgauer engineers dont deserve any kind of pedestal, only respect that's actually due.

question authority.

clarification: i'm referring to the switch location as a bad design. i didn't have the special tools, or knowledge of those tools, i guess, to fix the poorly located switch. their bad.
Last edited by ka on Mon Jul 06, 2009 8:23 pm, edited 3 times in total.
1973 710m
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David Dunn
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Post by David Dunn » Mon Jul 06, 2009 1:21 pm

G'Day Peter

Just goes to show, ya can be too smart for ya own britches
:lol: :wink:

I sometimes wonder if some of these chemists worked for Mircosoft at one time, and make everything not backward compatible, or a sinster plot to get older vehicles off the road :shock: :roll:

Dave
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The Trojan Horse... the 1st Pinz used to covertly carry troops into battle .




ATL Pinzgauer XM 718K TUM(HD) 6x6 FFR (aka The Green Grail)

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Thomas-E
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Post by Thomas-E » Mon Jul 06, 2009 6:39 pm

Hmmm..

If a pinzgauer came with a four-sided wheel, maybe a three sided one would be better.... Only three bumps instead of four 8)
Thomas E.
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Erik712m
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Post by Erik712m » Mon Jul 06, 2009 6:56 pm

Dumb question how often does the brake switch fail? Mine has never. But I know Russ made his own switch and I never asked why? Jim do replace them very often?

And to be honest I doubt I will know if it fails. until one of the po.po. come to drive it home after a night of drinking. :lol:

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David Dunn
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Post by David Dunn » Mon Jul 06, 2009 7:39 pm

Erik
They don't fail that often. We're talking about 30 year old plus vehicles.
These are basically no different than the oil pressure sender for the idiot light.
The last time I looked, these weren't on the maintenance schedule for replacement every 3000 miles. :roll:
I just replaced this same brake light switch on my 48 year Mighty Mite last year. These are not an issue. Just a little tougher to get to in a Pinz.

Dave
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The Trojan Horse... the 1st Pinz used to covertly carry troops into battle .




ATL Pinzgauer XM 718K TUM(HD) 6x6 FFR (aka The Green Grail)

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