Gotta start somewhere, right?!?
Gotta start somewhere, right?!?
Hey guys...I need advice....
I'm a noob to the off road arena, and i've been lurking this sight for years (only recently signed up). I know what I want to do, drive, build, but I also know I don't have the finances to pull it off RIGHT NOW. I also don't have ANY off roading experience. I'm not interested in cutting corners, and I'm adult enough to "wait"...but I am also a true believer in being prepared. An expeditionary C303 is what I'm after, but I don't want to have to learn all those hard lessons that are in store for me on one.
That said....is there any wisdom in picking up some kind of mundane interim off-road vehicle to learn a few things on first? I'm thinking about this in terms of part of the investment towards something better. Nothing comes cheap....and wisdom often pays for fewer repair bills than bravery....and Jeeps are cheaper to repair than Volvo's: https://minneapolis.craigslist.org/hnp/ ... 00740.html
I'm a noob to the off road arena, and i've been lurking this sight for years (only recently signed up). I know what I want to do, drive, build, but I also know I don't have the finances to pull it off RIGHT NOW. I also don't have ANY off roading experience. I'm not interested in cutting corners, and I'm adult enough to "wait"...but I am also a true believer in being prepared. An expeditionary C303 is what I'm after, but I don't want to have to learn all those hard lessons that are in store for me on one.
That said....is there any wisdom in picking up some kind of mundane interim off-road vehicle to learn a few things on first? I'm thinking about this in terms of part of the investment towards something better. Nothing comes cheap....and wisdom often pays for fewer repair bills than bravery....and Jeeps are cheaper to repair than Volvo's: https://minneapolis.craigslist.org/hnp/ ... 00740.html
- VinceAtReal4x4s
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Re: Gotta start somewhere, right?!?
Anything Toyota.
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- TechMOGogy
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Re: Gotta start somewhere, right?!?
What kind of wheeling do you want to do or is near you?
Rocks, mud, forest, sand, etc
That jeep would be ok but you would probably spend most of your time fixing it.
You don't necessarily need massive tires and crazy lifts.
To pick up skills, look for a 4x4 club near you as they often have beginner days or teaching days where you can wheel
stock vehicles but learn when to use 4x4 high/low, rear & front lockers, how to pick a line, various recovery techniques, etc.
It's always best to just get out and do it vs watching or reading how to do it.
Not sure where your located but will assume somewhere near Minneapolis - see what local clubs are around you and go to a meeting!
http://www.offroaders.com/4x4-trails/mi ... directory/
Rocks, mud, forest, sand, etc
That jeep would be ok but you would probably spend most of your time fixing it.
You don't necessarily need massive tires and crazy lifts.
To pick up skills, look for a 4x4 club near you as they often have beginner days or teaching days where you can wheel
stock vehicles but learn when to use 4x4 high/low, rear & front lockers, how to pick a line, various recovery techniques, etc.
It's always best to just get out and do it vs watching or reading how to do it.
Not sure where your located but will assume somewhere near Minneapolis - see what local clubs are around you and go to a meeting!
http://www.offroaders.com/4x4-trails/mi ... directory/
72 Pathfinder | 75 710M 2.7i | 96 350GDT Worker
Re: Gotta start somewhere, right?!?
Note that the Jeep posting did not mention the Diff or Tranie gear ratios.
If the Diff was not changed along with the increased Tires size this may
make a very poor crawler. Find one with Dana Axels and a decent X-case
or your off-roading may be limited to Forest roads
If the Diff was not changed along with the increased Tires size this may
make a very poor crawler. Find one with Dana Axels and a decent X-case
or your off-roading may be limited to Forest roads
Puller: 71' 710K 2.7L EFI aka Mozo
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- Jimm391730
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Re: Gotta start somewhere, right?!?
I initially had a Cherokee (not as built up as that one) that served me well, but mine had only the 4 banger which may have been the saving grace - too much power is often not beneficial, and this is what breaks things and teaches bad habits. Pinzgauers, on the other hand, have relatively tiny horsepower and conversely beefy drivetrain so it is very difficult to break, even when abused; the lack of power is NOT detrimental to where you can go (Mud and Sand slinging are the exceptions). You should have something to get the offroad experience with or you won't get any experience. You'll have fun with the Jeep but you may end up spending more than you expect, or not. You'll just have to dive in at some time, so go for it!
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Re: Gotta start somewhere, right?!?
If you intend to use the vehicle both off-road and on-road, make certain you buy one which meets the on-road equipment laws in your state.
Over-size tires, over-height bumpers, insufficient fender coverage, altered suspension are all examples of conditions which may be non-compliant depending on where you live.
Over-size tires, over-height bumpers, insufficient fender coverage, altered suspension are all examples of conditions which may be non-compliant depending on where you live.
It is better to go skiing and think of God, than go to church and think of sport. Fridjof Nansen
I hope to die in my ski boots... ...just not today. Me
I hope to die in my ski boots... ...just not today. Me
Re: Gotta start somewhere, right?!?
lol....i heard that....I'm also looking (more seriously) at this guy: https://minneapolis.craigslist.org/hnp/ ... 00128.htmlVinceAtReal4x4s wrote:Anything Toyota.
Re: Gotta start somewhere, right?!?
Well...we've got a bit of everything in this state. Up north is the iron range: rocky forests, creek fording, the occasional dry creek bed with mostly cobble and gravel. Down south is the plains: glacial moraine, sandy loes and pete, with a lot of mud holes and bogs. And the eastern border is Mississippi river country...with combinations of all that crap.TechMOGogy wrote:What kind of wheeling do you want to do or is near you?
Rocks, mud, forest, sand, etc
Whole heartedly agree with you...in fact, part of what intrigues me about that Jeep is the notion of trading those wheels/tires for some starry eyed jokers factory set up (and likely getting a little cash back in my pocket for them). Same with the springs in fact...I know enough to know I'm not going to need 8" of potential articulation!TechMOGogy wrote:That jeep would be ok but you would probably spend most of your time fixing it.
You don't necessarily need massive tires and crazy lifts.
will do! Thanks!TechMOGogy wrote:To pick up skills, look for a 4x4 club near you as they often have beginner days or teaching days where you can wheel
stock vehicles but learn when to use 4x4 high/low, rear & front lockers, how to pick a line, various recovery techniques, etc.
It's always best to just get out and do it vs watching or reading how to do it.
Not sure where your located but will assume somewhere near Minneapolis - see what local clubs are around you and go to a meeting!
http://www.offroaders.com/4x4-trails/mi ... directory/
Re: Gotta start somewhere, right?!?
That is true. It was my first set of questions....everything is factory. Not factory fluids/gears, mind you...but factory ratios. (he was not clear about what he might have replaced as a means of routine maintenance...) Which, if it follows your average production XJ I-6 w/ 5-speed....that would be:rmel wrote:Note that the Jeep posting did not mention the Diff or Tranie gear ratios.
If the Diff was not changed along with the increased Tires size this may
make a very poor crawler.
1st - 3.83
2nd - 2.33
3rd - 1.44
4th - 1
5th - 0.79
the transfer case is 2.72/1
Front axle - is a Dana 30 (high-pinion...better than the old CAD housing, lol): 1.16" diameter shafts, 7.13" ring gear
Rear axle - whereas this doesn't appear to be the dreaded Dana 35 with non c-clips (where by, the wheels would fall off should something catastrophic happen) it is still a Dana 35....and with this truck running 35"ers...i'm surprised it hasn't grenaded yet: 1.18" diameter shafts, 7.58" ring gear.
Gearing - an anemic 3.07.
Without the experience of knowing what a good set of numbers would feel like, I suspect even I would have a hard time being comfortable with these statistics. a 27 year old truck with 209k miles doesn't really need to be reving past 3k that often, lol....
BUT........ulterior motive below....
Re: Gotta start somewhere, right?!?
Well...and certainly after having run the numbers in rmel's point. There's something to be said about taking a set of new 35's on new wheels and exploiting some poor sap on craigslist looking to trade off his factory wheels. Same can be said for the overkill lift....Springs are easy to swap out...and who knows! I may make a profit on it!Jimm391730 wrote:I initially had a Cherokee (not as built up as that one) that served me well, but mine had only the 4 banger which may have been the saving grace - too much power is often not beneficial, and this is what breaks things and teaches bad habits. Pinzgauers, on the other hand, have relatively tiny horsepower and conversely beefy drivetrain so it is very difficult to break, even when abused; the lack of power is NOT detrimental to where you can go (Mud and Sand slinging are the exceptions). You should have something to get the offroad experience with or you won't get any experience. You'll have fun with the Jeep but you may end up spending more than you expect, or not. You'll just have to dive in at some time, so go for it!
Or I can do the sensible thing and pursue that 4Runner linked above...which is also street legal....and have a decent daily driver too!
I'm not gunna touch the Pinzgauer versus C303 debate though, lol....I have no doubt they're comparable in capability but....I'm a Volvo NUT!
Re: Gotta start somewhere, right?!?
Absolutely agreed...not interested in testing John Law's measuring sticks...undysworld wrote:If you intend to use the vehicle both off-road and on-road, make certain you buy one which meets the on-road equipment laws in your state.
Over-size tires, over-height bumpers, insufficient fender coverage, altered suspension are all examples of conditions which may be non-compliant depending on where you live.
Minnesota has nothing that keeps this particular rig off the road except for the bumpers....can't be higher than 25" from the bottom of the bumper to the pavement and can't be outside of 6" stock location. In other words....that jeep would need new bumpers.
Probably more relevant than that though is that this truck would never last long on the road at 80 MPH....if the gearing wasn't enough to put the cabosh on that, certain the fuel economy would, lol!
Re: Gotta start somewhere, right?!?
Thanks for all your input, guys(and/or gals?)! I like learning new things and I've done so today! I'll keep looking....and you know what? What the hell...i'll probably go take a look at the jeep too....just to say I did!