Questions - new to Pinzgauer - about to maybe purchase 710K

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JungleJudah
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Questions - new to Pinzgauer - about to maybe purchase 710K

Post by JungleJudah » Mon Oct 07, 2019 9:19 am

I have been driving a Honda Element, and it has done me well the past 12 years but it is not as rugged as I need. So I've been looking into alternative options. FJ Cruiser was good, but limited space in back (not enough to sleep). And thinking of 4wd truck (Tacoma or Dodge Cummins Diesel) with overland rig (Alu Canopy Cab Camper or GoFast). But I just found about the Pinzgauer and found one for sell (710K) and am very interested. I am also currently in the military, so further appreciate this unique vehicle. I appreciate any feedback you can provide on my concerns/questions below:

- Main hesitation to purchase is that the max speed is 60mph. So I suppose nothing can be done to improve this. Will driving at near 60 (such as 58) for several hours for a road trip cause excessive wear/tear on the vehicle? Or no problem to drive at ~58? How have you found this max speed as a detriment for your use of the vehicle? I am planning to have this vehicle as my daily driver in town as well as adventure vehicle. I suppose in town will actually only add few/several minutes to drive time. Road trip will add significant time.
What are your thoughts on this vehicle as my daily driver in town?

- It is V4, not V6. And gasoline, not diesel. How much disadvantage is having not diesel and not V6? And in this regards, what is the towing capacity? And how much gear/weight can I load inside the vehicle? Such as loading heaving rocks (I am a geologist / fossil hunter / rockhound) and logs.

- There is no A/C, and the heater was said to be unsafe. I will need A/C. I suppose I can install aftermarket systems? Any preferences; systems that can run on the battery so as to not overutilize the engine?

- What type of MPG can I expect? And if loaded with gear and/or people?

- Reliability / Longevity. I need my vehicle to be reliable, and ensure that arrive where I intend to arrive (such as my job!). And I hope to keep the vehicle for 10 or 20+ or more years. What are your thoughts on these aspects? And how about maintenance - do I need to do maintenance myself or can take to local garage? And what about obtaining parts - need to special order (expensive?) or can use parts such as from Autozone?

- I also plan to make additional upgrades and I'm sure will find more info/ideas on these forums. But if you have any initial thoughts on below; I'd appreciate. Roof rack; plan to install a roof rack and will need to determine which. Sleeping platform/system inside the vehicle: will use occasionally/rarely such as when stopping at a rest stop during road trip - perhaps make something such as fold out platform from the wall. Spotlights and other enhancements - I'm sure are lots of options and ideas on these forums.

- So now that I'm considering to purchase this Pinzgauer 710K, should I remain with the idea/plan to purchase this vehicle? Or should I consider other vehicles? Other Pinzgauer models with higher top speed? Volvo 303? LR 101

Thank you very much in advance for your feedback and advice!
Judah
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rmel
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Re: Questions - new to Pinzgauer - about to maybe purchase 710K

Post by rmel » Mon Oct 07, 2019 10:03 am

The first thing you should do is go drive one for at least an hour or so, HWY and city.
That will answer a number of questions you have that would be difficult for anyone
to qualitatively provide you in written form.

I can tell you one thing, if your driving in the flatland's, let's say Dallas for example
your 60mph at 3600+ RPM so it's gonna be noisy without a fair amount of noise deadening
material. On the other hand if your driving with any grade e.g. say Sierra mountain passes,
your gonna find yourself behind the big rigs doing closer to 45. So all depends.

All not that bad given it's a 4 cy, air-cooled gasser with ~100HP. These were engineered
for high torque at relatively low RPM not the other way around.
Puller: 71' 710K 2.7L EFI aka Mozo
Follower: Sankey MK 3, 3/4 Tonne
Rescue Pinz: 73' 712M

Driver: Ron // KO0Q

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VinceAtReal4x4s
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Re: Questions - new to Pinzgauer - about to maybe purchase 710K

Post by VinceAtReal4x4s » Mon Oct 07, 2019 12:55 pm

Your desires are very common but there is no solution like you want there to be. I've been trying to find it myself since the 90's. It doesn't exist unless you have serious money and lots of patience.

I can tell from what you are asking that you'd likely be much happier in the long run with a Toyota pick-up with a camper on the back of it.
"For those who risk, life has a flavor the protected shall never enjoy"

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pinzi
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Re: Questions - new to Pinzgauer - about to maybe purchase 710K

Post by pinzi » Mon Oct 07, 2019 3:21 pm

Or you step it up...lets say a 716 or 718... :roll:
off-road until i die

JungleJudah
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Re: Questions - new to Pinzgauer - about to maybe purchase 710K

Post by JungleJudah » Tue Oct 08, 2019 9:49 am

Thanks for all the feedback. I haven't found much information or trucks for sale of 716 or 718. On these forums earlier this year there is/was an awesome 716K P80 for sale, but is in England. As 716 is diesel, does it get better MPG, and other advantages? What is the max speed of the 716?

I also emailed Bob at buypinzgauer.com and he informed me that he has a high speed transmission which can enable the Pinzgauer to drive at highway speeds. Your thoughts on this? The max speed limitation is my main hesitation to purchase a Pinzgauer.

And the Pinzgauer I looked at a couple of days already just sold yesterday. So no problem - gives me more time to research and perhaps find a Pinzgauer (or other vehicle) best suited for myself.

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rmel
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Re: Questions - new to Pinzgauer - about to maybe purchase 710K

Post by rmel » Tue Oct 08, 2019 10:24 am

The "high speed transmission" is likely the 716/718 "Turbo-diesel" ZF manual 5 speed transmission in a 710.
Yes, this will increase HWY speed ON THE FLATS ONLY as 5'th is an over-drive -but- the stock engine is
not suited to provide the necessary torque to match the increased load this tranie will incur. It's a bad
"impedance match". The only way to get any oomph with this tranie is to also modify the engine with the
2.7L EFI conversion and that STILL will not be insufficient. You will also find trail performance is severely
compromised with 1'st gear 25% higher than stock -- you won't crawl you will race walk over obstacles
and that's dangerous -- been there done that.
Last edited by rmel on Wed Oct 09, 2019 10:54 am, edited 1 time in total.
Puller: 71' 710K 2.7L EFI aka Mozo
Follower: Sankey MK 3, 3/4 Tonne
Rescue Pinz: 73' 712M

Driver: Ron // KO0Q

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VinceAtReal4x4s
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Re: Questions - new to Pinzgauer - about to maybe purchase 710K

Post by VinceAtReal4x4s » Tue Oct 08, 2019 10:33 am

The big picture here is the 710K shouldn't go faster than around 60 or 65 anyway. It's a very short wheelbase, top-heavy 4x4 that becomes super dangerous the faster it goes. I wouldn't put my family in one and drive 70mph in it. One little mistake on the highway and you are flipping over without doubt.

A diesel Pinz requires a very dedicated mechanic/owner, esp. if you are in the US. You are mostly alone on parts and service, if you can find parts. You'll be ordering from Europe and tracking down bits of info on forums, etc..
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rmel
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Re: Questions - new to Pinzgauer - about to maybe purchase 710K

Post by rmel » Tue Oct 08, 2019 11:05 am

Aptly put Vince -- DANGEROUS going anything faster than 60'ish -and- on the straits.

On windy down grades I typically go slower than the recommended posted speed,
that makes me the slowest rig on the hills and it's comforting although annoying
for anyone behind me.
Puller: 71' 710K 2.7L EFI aka Mozo
Follower: Sankey MK 3, 3/4 Tonne
Rescue Pinz: 73' 712M

Driver: Ron // KO0Q

Texas710
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Re: Questions - new to Pinzgauer - about to maybe purchase 710K

Post by Texas710 » Sat Oct 12, 2019 7:42 am

I absolutely love my Pinz 710M but...

These trucks are beast, but they are not designed for fast around town driving. You need a fair amount of mechanical know-how to work on them, they have drum brakes, no a/c, are loud as hell, stink (hope the wife or girlfriend likes to smell like gas), and are pretty slow (granted faster than most other vehicles that have the same off-road capabilities).

All in all, my truck is not used as a daily driver (mechanically it could). I don't think I would be super excited to climb in and drive one all day, every day, in traffic and out. A Truck with A/C is going to be better. That said, make sure you get a truck that can tow about 10k pounds and a trailer because once you get the Pinz bug, it's hard to get rid of.

pinzi
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Re: Questions - new to Pinzgauer - about to maybe purchase 710K

Post by pinzi » Sat Oct 12, 2019 11:38 am

Hello

I drive my 716 everyday as a daily driver , it can go with traffic without anny problems but yes it has disc brakes, powersteering and a bit less noisy and there are no gass fumes :roll:
off-road until i die

JungleJudah
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Re: Questions - new to Pinzgauer - about to maybe purchase 710K

Post by JungleJudah » Sat Oct 12, 2019 10:33 pm

What is the max speed of the 716? What speed can you cruise down the highway for prolonged time? (safety and mechanics)
And is there 716 in Automatic (not manual)? Are all 716s less noisy, or has been modified?
716 seems better than 710? Any disadvantages to the 716 (other than perhaps harder to find, and maybe higher cost)?
Pinzi, is your 716 diesel - are they all diesel - if so, is maintenance and parts more difficult as is diesel?

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David Dunn
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Re: Questions - new to Pinzgauer - about to maybe purchase 710K

Post by David Dunn » Sun Oct 13, 2019 1:04 am

Judah,
In the last 20 years I’ve owned one of each series of Pinzes and had a P80 716 for 10 years and the last 5 years a ATL 718k w/2.5l TDI.
Without a doubt I can say the TDs are far more user friendly and easily can exceed 75 mph. Driving at that speed for long distances will wear gears and bearing faster and uses expensive gear lube in the portals.. Almost everything must come from Europe except for a few filters that are pretty generic for VW diesels. Other than the basic engine of the P80 TDs, none of the later diesels were use by any car manufacturers imported into the US, but were used in different models for European consumption, hence easier for Pinzi to source parts.

In simple numbers, over 18000 710 and 712 were made from 1970 to 1986-ish.
By comparison, 1985 to 2000 less than 6000 716/718s were made in both LHD and RHD ( consider that ATL had the license for Pinzes from 1994 on ). In 2000. the manufacture of Pinzes was in the UK , where 1214 were made and only the one made after 2003 were the 2.5 TDI. With ATL being a UK company, their primary customers were Commonwealth countries that lean more toward RHD.

You being in the US, importation of a 716 or 718 has to be 25 years or older. An estimate of eligible vehicles would be at less than 4000 ( remembering those are LHD and RHD, manual and auto trans).

Lastly, an early 716 will probably be a minimum for $45k and to over $65k to a newer manufactured or 718. Though not as glamorous, you could buy a very nice NEW Toyota 4x4 pickup with a warranty! Personally, I would not have a Pinz as my only vehicle if I had to rely on it for my income because it is possible to have a breakdown that can sideline it for weeks.
.
The Trojan Horse... the 1st Pinz used to covertly carry troops into battle .




ATL Pinzgauer XM 718K TUM(HD) 6x6 FFR (aka The Green Grail)

pinzi
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Re: Questions - new to Pinzgauer - about to maybe purchase 710K

Post by pinzi » Sun Oct 13, 2019 4:39 am

Hi
I have a verry early 716. ( vin number 9 ! ) , and yes all 716 /718 are diesels , most of them have the 6 cyl td diesel engine from vw/ Audi....this engine was used in the vw lt , Volvo 240 / 740 / 760 / 940 ....the later 5 cyl tdi you can find in the Audi A6 / Volvo 850 / v70 .....so here in Europa There's no problem finding parts or engines.....the gearbox on mine is the zf4hp22 automatic.....you find these in Range Rovers , Volvo 740 ..the 716 is verry diferent to the 710 Like i said There's no hauwling noise from the 710 aircooled engine....discbrakes to drumbrakes....powersteering to none ...mine has the airsuspension in the back ....drives top speed 125km/U but feels best around the 100km/ U...downside is That it will be verry hard to find a good 716k LHD as not so manny where build , mine is one of 211 civillian ones ever build and this include 716 lhd and rhd , 718 lhd and rhd...and there are more 718 build and even more rhd ones so i dont know exactly hoe manny civillian 716 k lhd are made but i guess not more Than 100. :roll:
off-road until i die

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