Flat Towing a Pinz
Posted: Fri Sep 19, 2008 7:37 pm
Anyone flat tow their Pinz? Can you post photos of the tow bar setup you're using?
THE PORTAL HUB - Pinzgauers, Haflingers, Volvo 303s and more!
From Vince Sweeney: You have arrived at the original "Real 4x4's" Forums, founded in 1999.
https://real4x4forums.com/PinzgauerBBS/
Flat Towing a Pinz
Page 1 of 2
Posted: Sat Sep 20, 2008 6:39 pm
Definitely an old topic. Info probably lost from past site crash thou if you have done a search :?:
Posted: Sat Sep 20, 2008 7:01 pm
Yes, did a search. I know its an old topic, but I didn't have a need to know...then. Thanks.
Posted: Sat Sep 20, 2008 9:03 pm
I thought about doing this when I first bought my Pinz. I changed my mind for the following reasons:
1) Wear and tear on much of the drive train. I typically only drive the Pinz at 55 but it is possible to tow at a much higher speed. Why put the strain on 30+ year old portal axles, etc.
2) A braking system is required (by law) as the Pinz is heavy. Adding a "Brake Buddy" or something similar is probably $700+ and I really don't know how well it would work. Remember, your Pinz brakes might not be well balanced and the speeds you might towing at need good braking.
3) You will need to install trailer lighting. That's the easiest thing on the list
4) You'll need a tow bar of some kind. Note the height difference between your Pinz bumper and the tow vehicle. Not the same height is it?
5) It takes a fairly substantial vehicle to even flat tow the Pinz. That is the most expensive part of the towing equation. If you have the tow vehicle already why not spend the money you're budgeting for flat towing wisely and get a trailer.
I bought a 14K pound two axle equipment trailer that is 20' long and has electric brakes on both axles. It tows a 710 or 712 fine. It will also take care of a Unimog 404. I spent $90 on a very nice proportional brake controller for my 3/4 ton pickup. I carry an extra two trailer wheels in case I blow out both tires on one side. I even have a small winch on the nose of the trailer (2000 lb) that I have doubled up (4000 lb) and easily pulled a full size Blazer with wheels so wide they scraped the inside of the wheel fenders (I haven't needed to drag up the Pinz yet, knock on wood). Trailer was about $2500 with another $200 for two spare tires. Winch was a Harbor Freight special. Another $100 for chains and binder. This was a few years ago, your prices will vary.
I've had to make some very fast stops because of stupid people on the Interstate. I shudder to think of those same stops if I was flat towing my Pinz.
This is an old pic. Pinz still has AT tires rather than Swampers. I also now use chains as they are required by law in FL, well at least one chain.
1) Wear and tear on much of the drive train. I typically only drive the Pinz at 55 but it is possible to tow at a much higher speed. Why put the strain on 30+ year old portal axles, etc.
2) A braking system is required (by law) as the Pinz is heavy. Adding a "Brake Buddy" or something similar is probably $700+ and I really don't know how well it would work. Remember, your Pinz brakes might not be well balanced and the speeds you might towing at need good braking.
3) You will need to install trailer lighting. That's the easiest thing on the list
4) You'll need a tow bar of some kind. Note the height difference between your Pinz bumper and the tow vehicle. Not the same height is it?
5) It takes a fairly substantial vehicle to even flat tow the Pinz. That is the most expensive part of the towing equation. If you have the tow vehicle already why not spend the money you're budgeting for flat towing wisely and get a trailer.
I bought a 14K pound two axle equipment trailer that is 20' long and has electric brakes on both axles. It tows a 710 or 712 fine. It will also take care of a Unimog 404. I spent $90 on a very nice proportional brake controller for my 3/4 ton pickup. I carry an extra two trailer wheels in case I blow out both tires on one side. I even have a small winch on the nose of the trailer (2000 lb) that I have doubled up (4000 lb) and easily pulled a full size Blazer with wheels so wide they scraped the inside of the wheel fenders (I haven't needed to drag up the Pinz yet, knock on wood). Trailer was about $2500 with another $200 for two spare tires. Winch was a Harbor Freight special. Another $100 for chains and binder. This was a few years ago, your prices will vary.
I've had to make some very fast stops because of stupid people on the Interstate. I shudder to think of those same stops if I was flat towing my Pinz.
This is an old pic. Pinz still has AT tires rather than Swampers. I also now use chains as they are required by law in FL, well at least one chain.
Posted: Sat Sep 20, 2008 10:37 pm
To add to Russ post:
Whereas if you're driving the Pinz, you are aware of all of the indiosyncrasies around you. When flat towing, you have no sense or feel for a portal bearing failure until it is too late, either by the additional drag, or smoke.
If while out on the trail, something breaks, you may not be able to flat tow your Pinz back.
In Russ' pic, the front pin is not a good tiedown point. The stress on the front clip will distort the body (forward and down) and the doors can pop open. I use the front and rear outriggers for the platform to tiedown to.
Whereas if you're driving the Pinz, you are aware of all of the indiosyncrasies around you. When flat towing, you have no sense or feel for a portal bearing failure until it is too late, either by the additional drag, or smoke.
If while out on the trail, something breaks, you may not be able to flat tow your Pinz back.
In Russ' pic, the front pin is not a good tiedown point. The stress on the front clip will distort the body (forward and down) and the doors can pop open. I use the front and rear outriggers for the platform to tiedown to.
Posted: Sun Sep 21, 2008 7:10 am
Really good points. Thanks All.
Posted: Sun Sep 21, 2008 5:30 pm
Russ, well wrote. Some great points. how ever some of us would rather just drive are pinz 
Posted: Sun Sep 21, 2008 5:59 pm
"how ever some of use would rather just drive are pinz"
What?
What?
Posted: Sun Sep 21, 2008 6:06 pm
Sorry my ipod finished us as use
Posted: Sun Sep 21, 2008 6:08 pm
Back in the 70s I had a friend who towed a 60s Mustang on a dolly with the rear tires on the ground. Manual transmission, no problem, right? Wrong. His wife left it in gear. Not just any gear, first gear! Someone saw the smoke and got him to pull over on the Interstate, as he was driving a big U-Haul. A new 289 was in order. Several years later the wife got replaced, too.
Posted: Sun Sep 21, 2008 6:10 pm
translated..OhioPinz wrote:"how ever some of use would rather just drive are pinz"
What?
however, some of us would rather just drive our Pinz....
Don't you have a Buck Roger Decoder ring?.... you really do need one...
Posted: Sun Sep 21, 2008 6:43 pm
Yes, please, a decoder ring...
Posted: Sun Sep 21, 2008 9:07 pm
I drove mine everywhere for about 5 years. I still drive to a few local things but I love my Swampers and they are very happy in the dirt and mud. Pavement, not so much.
Of course the original post was about flat towing, not whether you should drive or tow.
BTW, when I was still driving my Pinz it always got me home. Often our drives were a good 2 hours by Pinz on Interstate.
Dave, I do still use the front pin with a chain. I haven't had any problems, perhaps it is because I have a K. I am looking at making different tie down points on my trailer so I will look at better points on the front of the Pinz while I am at it. I currently tie down using only chains. Easier and definitely legal. If you get a chance, send or post a pic of the front tie down points you use.
Oh, correction on earlier post: I haven't needed to drag up the Pinz since I bought the winch. On one trip I had the fortune of a Unimog with a winch angled to the front of my trailer to pull up my Pinz. Much better than the come-a-long I had at the time! Coil died, no spare. Now I carry a spare.
Of course the original post was about flat towing, not whether you should drive or tow.
BTW, when I was still driving my Pinz it always got me home. Often our drives were a good 2 hours by Pinz on Interstate.
Dave, I do still use the front pin with a chain. I haven't had any problems, perhaps it is because I have a K. I am looking at making different tie down points on my trailer so I will look at better points on the front of the Pinz while I am at it. I currently tie down using only chains. Easier and definitely legal. If you get a chance, send or post a pic of the front tie down points you use.
Oh, correction on earlier post: I haven't needed to drag up the Pinz since I bought the winch. On one trip I had the fortune of a Unimog with a winch angled to the front of my trailer to pull up my Pinz. Much better than the come-a-long I had at the time! Coil died, no spare. Now I carry a spare.
Posted: Mon Sep 22, 2008 2:41 am
Russ
The geometery of pulling forward and down from the front pin will put stress on the front clip..... After watching an idiot tow truck driver putting tension at the pin, both doors popped open. This is less likely on a K because of the hardtop is solidly fastened the top of the windshield frame, but the base of the frame is still only secured at the corners by a thin steel plate, or typical M pivots( Seen Ks both ways), which may easily bend. If you ever seen the pics where tiedown plates were welded to the front extentions, they are done low nearer the back of the extension where the leverage on the extention is less.
These pics from years ago, on my old trailer. I have since gone to "wrecker" J hooks at these same points. I'm a lazy sod, and the J hooks are sooo much quicker to use.
BTW, that trailer was 12', and fine for a 710 or 716.
I changed to a 14' one that is lighter for CGVWR behind my RV, and is suitable for 712s too( and still have the right balance for the proper tongue weight).
The geometery of pulling forward and down from the front pin will put stress on the front clip..... After watching an idiot tow truck driver putting tension at the pin, both doors popped open. This is less likely on a K because of the hardtop is solidly fastened the top of the windshield frame, but the base of the frame is still only secured at the corners by a thin steel plate, or typical M pivots( Seen Ks both ways), which may easily bend. If you ever seen the pics where tiedown plates were welded to the front extentions, they are done low nearer the back of the extension where the leverage on the extention is less.
These pics from years ago, on my old trailer. I have since gone to "wrecker" J hooks at these same points. I'm a lazy sod, and the J hooks are sooo much quicker to use.
BTW, that trailer was 12', and fine for a 710 or 716.
I changed to a 14' one that is lighter for CGVWR behind my RV, and is suitable for 712s too( and still have the right balance for the proper tongue weight).Posted: Mon Sep 22, 2008 2:54 am
BTW Russ
It's always better to have a winch and not need it, than going "ah $hit".
My Dodge Ram has one front and rear( primarily to load the trailer), and the Pink Cow is currently having the installation of it's front and rear winches finished (Wiring)
It's always better to have a winch and not need it, than going "ah $hit".
My Dodge Ram has one front and rear( primarily to load the trailer), and the Pink Cow is currently having the installation of it's front and rear winches finished (Wiring)