Offroading advice

[4x4Pinz]

going downhill in a 710, I would leave the front unlocked so I could manage steering better. The rear wants so badly to swap with the front that steering is a must. One of the biggest advantages in being with a group of pinzgauers is the ability to see the obstacle done before you have to try. One of the past trips out I had a passenger who never had even seen a pinzgauer before but by the end of the day I could no longer get him to grab the hand holds when the tires came off the ground. It is a matter of becoming comfortable and learning how far you can push it. With some owners even lifting a tire a foot off the ground is as far as they will ever get. You really need to spend time behind the wheel and start small in controlled areas. If you take your time you will find just how capable these trucks are. I have had the opportunity to wheel with many owners in different states and it is interesting to see where their comfort levels are and how much farther they have to go.
Take it easy and become comfortable before getting in over your head. And yes slow and easy is usually the best approach. These are not jeeps where "when in doubt gas it out" is the norm.

[berger]

^ +1

I totally agree. I had all lockers on going up that sandy mound in one of my pics, but I turned it off at the top. On downhill rocks, I turn it off because steering without power-steering is hard enough and the locker only makes it worse. My goal now for every steep downhill I attempt is to be in low, 1st gear, and let the truck make its own way down.

That being said, I still pucker, I won't lie, but I am getting better. The closed course I did last weekend helped immensely. When you see some of the pics people took of my wheels in the air, it looks kinda scary, but to tell you the truth, I was so focused on the course I didn't even realize that they were...I just drove and the truck cooperated.

[4x4Pinz]

YEP, low and slow is the Pinz way of doing things. In many cases when I am out playing, I don't even realize I have lifted a tire. The transition from being on the ground to air and back to ground is smooth at very low speeds. If done right you won't feel the tire come up or drop back down.
Remember it takes less time to drive the obstacle slow then it does to recover the truck and make repairs caused from a flop.

[undysworld]

What is the proper technique when on 2 or three wheels? I had 4wd and rear locked, but realize now I should have front locked also. Get a spotter and take it slow?

You're talking downhill here, right? If so, you've got your brakes, and your engine braking effect.

Your brakes are what they are, and they are not effected by the lockers being locked or unlocked. Use as needed.

Your engine braking will only effect those wheels which are engaged via lockers. Without anything locked in, only the rear axle is engaged with an unlocked differential which may allow tire slip as only one tire is really engaged to hold you back. By locking the first locker, this engine braking effect will be doubled since now the front axle is engaged, but with the same unlocked differential concerns. It's better, but still can result in slipping.

Locking either the front or the back differential lockers will further help, because now both wheels on the diff-locked axle will be slowed by the engine. Locking the front diff. will cause the truck to steer hard, but in really steep declines, it's likely that there will be enough tire slip to allow some steering. But locking the rear can allow both rear tires to slip, if things are steep enough. If both rear tires lose grip, the truck can slew sideways as the rear does not have even one tire following straight.

It's similar to a race car with adjustable brake bias, where you want the rear tires to lock up only after the fronts, if at all, so that the car does not spin under extreme braking.

A 712 seems a bit more forgiving, with two rear axles, so you can more frequently leave everything locked. But in general, I'd always leave the rear differential unlocked on really steep declines, use the brakes as needed, and just slip my way down as a last resort.

Use a spotter when you feel the need, and always take it slow.

[4x4Pinz]

this was taken at one of my favorite teaching areas. This area provides all kinds of obstacles to teach new pinz owners how to handle different situations, from sand to big rocks.
In this photo we lock the rear only, no transfer case or front with the tcase in low range and tranny in first gear. This provides what little engine braking there is available and the use of regular brakes. As you can see once the front right wheel clears the hole he is going to need to make a hard left turn to line up with the next ledge. With the weight of the truck on the front end having the lockers engaged would make that turn almost impossible. In this case constant pressure on the brake pedal to control speed is a must. When he first attempted this downhill with everything locked he came extremely close to rolling the truck (he got a lucky bounce on the lower ledge). On these types of downhills where it is steep, loose and has ledges abrupt braking is a big no no (it will cause the rear to try and come over the top) constant pressure on the pedal is maintained and ease the truck down. Very comfortable once you get used to it.
The 712 really does not have a line on these as it will just cruise down them.

[4x4Pinz]

You can not tell from the photo but the passenger side rear tires are off the ground in this photo. Again the front is unlocked as is the tcase. I had to make a hard left hand turn once I got down just little more. Yeah I know it is a 712 but some of the operations are similar. Note that this is solid surface and not loose as with the case of in the above photo but it did not change the setup.

[berger]

What exactly do you mean by "the transfer case is not locked?" Not in 4x4?




Sent from my Mobile

[4x4Pinz]

yep

[berger]

yep

Cool.

I keep forgetting I can lock with being in 4x4.

[4x4Pinz]

In the advance portion I cover the use of lockers and how they can manage different obstacles. I can show you how a 712 will turn a four foot circle with very little effort if you lockers are working properly. I make switchbacks with a 712 where a 710 will three point them. Even showed the FJ crowd that I could out turn them on the trail, they all had to three point turn around and I just spun the 712 in one fluid motion.
Great trucks.

[totaljoint]

In the advance portion I cover the use of lockers

So where do we sign up for these lessons?!

[eToothpaste]

How about a lesson in Moab this fall?

[4x4Pinz]

well the big hang up is that they occur in the Phoenix, Az and surrounding area. We have some exceptional trails of all levels that provide great opportunities for offroad enthusiast. I take people out when their schedules allow as mine tends to be very flexible. I usually take either my 710 or 712 depending on which one they are interested in learning as some folks are afraid that they will hurt their trucks. Of course I am not going to have them do anything that might cause harm to their truck so I let them drive one of mine if they don't feel comfortable.

I do need to get up to WA some day and get some trail time in there. Even if it is just the NWMF.

Now MOAB would be fun. Might have to consider heading back up there. Should get in touch with the RMP guys as they used to get to MOAB fairly regularly. Could be a great gathering if done right.

[berger]

What do you think I should have done differently here?? Different line? I think it was due to the hole at the bottom catching the tire, as I was not braking. Transfer case was locked, 1st gear, low. She really jumped on me. That is the same spot my Avatar depicts.

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=rU0FU_FqVEE

Same link for Tapatalk:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=rU0FU_FqVEE

Going up that rock step was MUCH better yesterday. Took my own line and went straight at it. Maybe a little fast, but no issues.

[TechMOGogy]

Wow - that looked scary - it really hopped.
I am no expert (and I want to see what some of the experts say so I know/learn) but I would say: should have been going much slower. I also think you had your thumbs (saw left I think) through steering wheel as you were coming down - with the wheels going all over that is a easy way to break them :?:
I wish I could slow video down!
I can see how with a bit deeper hole and nothing for rear to grab it could swing right around