Stereo Speakers in a Pinz

[Pinz710m2]

I remember reading some posts about people having difficulty
putting a decent sound system in a Pinz. I beg to differ. I am
installing a unit that has no head unit ... just a remote control.
It's made by classiccarstereos.com. And the speaker placement
is something that I'm a bit of a specialist at. For reference, the
speakers in the pics are the JBL GTO629 with the GT19T tweeter,
and there's a Kenwood KSC-SW11 subwoofer. The subwoofer fits
perfectly (with a little home-made bracket) between the supports
on the driver's side wall. (Behind the seat, below your left elbow
when you are sitting in the driver's seat) I haven't finished the wiring
yet, but I just finished the final install and everything just needs to be
hooked up. (It's too darn hot out there right now)

Pics:

[krick3tt]

Not trying to be difficult but, how do you get stereo with the speaker directly over your head?

[Pinz710m2]

Of course you are trying to be difficult. That's what people
do on these bulletin boards.

How do you hear stereo when you are in a room and the
speakers are not directly on opposite sides of the room?
Human beings have 2 ears. This allows you to triangulate
sounds, thus determining their origin. How do you know
that when someone makes a noise behind you you should
turn around? For that matter, how can you hear the stereo
in your car when the speakers are on the door, or the dash
or in the back seat!!? Yes, it was a silly question.

The correct question/statement would be, "Holy Cow! How
did you fit decent speakers, a tweeter, and a subwoofer all
in the spaces provided in a Pinz? Some people put silly
knee-busting boxes on the dash, or big speaker boxes in the
back. Nice job of designing a system that fits."

Oh, and I can guarantee it's going to sound very good. I might
possibly have to add a capacitor to the subwoofer to compensate
for peak power draw from the amp, but I'm not sure on that yet.
My 12V power supply is a military grade VICOR vipac array.
It's a crazy sophisticated power supply, so I'm going to see how
its' circuitry works without it first.

[krick3tt]

Now that it has been explained to me in a scientific way I feel much better.

[audiocontr]

Yay! an audio question! I'm trying to be difficult btw

1) You installed an audio system. You did poorly at implementing a stereo. You're better off running it in mono with your current speaker locations, sorta like a 70v ceiling speaker PA system in a hotel lobby.
2) More tweeters does not equal more better sound.

The install looks nice. Good for you for implementing a sub (curious if your headlights dim) as it adds a lot of missing content. Where did you put it? Ported? Sealed? Can you fit a lil bandpass somewhere for the added volume?

In regards to spatial perception, or stereo "triangulation", its a function of space & time. Or in our case, distance and time. The audio was recorded with the intention of the left and right information arriving to the listener at the same time (across the frequency spectrum). This is accomplished by equalizing the distance of the left and right speakers on a common plane. When you shorten the distance to one speaker, you create a left\right bias, and your brain perceives you're positioned in a totally different position than the audio engineer imagined. You wont die. It simply wont sound as intended.

There are ways to compensate. Introduce a time delay on the closest speaker and you can start to trick your mind. Or place the speakers as far away from the listener as possible to decrease the delta (kick panels)

The same notion of distance applies across frequencies. In a coaxial, the tweeter is a couple inches closer to the listener than the midrange woofer. This means the high frequencies are arriving sooner than the mids by a ms and should also cause a spatial issue with your minds perception. by separating the tweeter from the woofer, you can install the voicecoils on a common plane, equalizing the distance. No one really takes advantage of the true reason they're separated in car audio and just install separates because some marketing genius back in the day made us all think that separates = better. Its not entirely true.

Brings us back to your install. You have 4 tweeters, two mids and a sub. Why all the tweeters?

This is all a purist argument which is absolutely silly in a pinzgauer. Get some sound in there and move on.

[krick3tt]

Thank you.

[Jim LaGuardia]

Nice install, but...........the overhead speakers will hurt if you hit your head on them(you must be under 5'3" to not hit).
How do I know? Been there done that
First time I hit a pothole and smacked my head(and knocked off speaker grill) they were promptly re located
Now I just use my Ipod
To each his own, carry on

[undysworld]

Brings us back to your install. You have 4 tweeters, two mids and a sub. Why all the tweeters?

One theory might be that the higher the frequency, the more directional they tend to be. That's how a single subwoofer can stand in for separate bass cabinets in many "satellite" systems. The bass is fairly non-directional. Generally, it used to be that the lower the driver, the more flexible location-wise. I assume that still holds true.

It might be possible to locate a left and a right hi speaker for each front passenger, and get more of a stereo effect for each seat.

A fellow I know sells and installs systems that have integrated phase delay (and parametric eq controls) for each driver output. But even there, when you tune the system to the driver's position, every other seat suffers some. I can't believe how small the amps and flat-panel woofers have gotten, since back in my day.

IMHO, the fact of the matter is that the trucks are so damn loud that it's pretty much impossible to get good sound while driving.

[EmbarkChief]

All that seems way too complex. I wear earbuds under ear protection for long trips and use a UE Boom Bluetooth speaker for low speed ops.

[Pinz710m2]

Undysworld has the right idea. Bass is non-directional. High frequency sound
does not carry well. You can't see it, but the tweeters on the main speakers are
pointed forward. The angle of dispersion will ensure that it can be heard evenly,
all through the cab. The mid range is close to your head, but it is what it is. Nothing
is gonna be perfect in a place that stereos aren't designed to be put. The equalizer
in the head unit should be able to compensate. (and a 5.6KHz cap on the tweeters)
If I have to, I can add a sound processor, but it's a convertible and I don't want anything
that looks like something to steal. The stereo is just a green metal box on the wall in
the back.

And Jim, I did check the head bashing factor. lol I intentionally went over some bumps
with no seat belt (I'm 6'0") and I hit my head on the front part of the rubber. Maybe that
was just me, but I moved them back enough that I think It'll be okay.

Oh, and I've done a ton of soundproofing. The noise levels are actually pretty low.

[berger]

Now that it has been explained to me in a scientific way I feel much better.

How dare you be difficult Morris! Can't you see this is the best stereo anyone could ever install in a Pinzgauer ever?! Not only do I have two ears, I got two eyes too...and even I see that!

[krick3tt]

Perhaps my sarcasm fell short of the mark....although I did get yours.
I hope the man gets that we are here for a social media event and will not be so thin skinned. I have speakers in approximately the same location and there is no stereo.
Truck is just too damn loud.

[audiocontr]

Undysworld has the right idea. Bass is non-directional. High frequency sound does not carry well.

Not a true statement. Bass is directional. Anything audible has a direction. Sub woofers reproducing sound below 80hz are difficult to locate because the sound is inaudible to normal hearing. Put a crappy crossover on that sub with a 3db slope and i guarantee you'll be able to tell where that sub is! Most "subs" fall into this category.

"low frequency is not obstructed as easily as high" make sense to me. High frequency sound carries very well with less energy. Its simply easier to obstruct or reflect because of the smaller wavelengths

The angle of dispersion will ensure that it can be heard evenly, all through the cab.

100% opposite of reality. You may be able to hear it throughout the front cab, but it is by no means equal. Its MUCH louder at the drivers left ear than his right.

Nothing is gonna be perfect in a place that stereos aren't designed to be put.

TOTALLY agree.

[Pinz710m2]

Not even sure how to answer audiocontr. I guess all that book learnin' was wrong.

Frankly, I'm not even sure why this is such a controversial topic. I'm guessing that
anyone who has ever owned or installed a stereo considers themselves an expert?
Reality and theory are two different things. I'm not going to debate theory. And frankly,
I'm not defensive enough to have to debate reality. For those who understand it, you're
welcome for the info. Everyone else ... you guys just have to live with yourselves. Go
be haters somewhere else.