Pinzgauer Cost in 70s?

[berger]

Hey Guys.

I have been asked this question a few times, and I have only been able to speculate. I am on my phone so searching is hard. I was told that the rebuilt Iltis I used to own, and paid $6500 for, cost the Canadian Government around $85,000CAN in 1985. What would my 1974 710M have cost the Swiss Military in 1974?

Thanks


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[TechMOGogy]

I asked same question
viewtopic.php?f=9&t=8206&hilit=Pinz+cost+when+new
Cheers,

[berger]

Thanks Dan!

I thought I contributed once. Nice to get a definitive answer though.


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[Profpinz]

In Australia in 1974 a civilian 712 cost $16,500Aus (the Aus Dollar was above parity in those days, so I'd guess about $17+K US)

[GenevaPinz]

I checked the german-language forum and they have discussed it already.

They mention 70'000 Swiss Francs paid by the Swiss military for a 712M in the early '70s, which at the time was equivalent to... about USD 17'500, so spot on Prof's estimate.

They also mention new prices in 1976 for the Austrian Army of 380'000 Austrian Shillings -still for a 712M-, equivalent to about USD 20'500. By comparison, the 710M was ATS 330'000, so about USD 17'800.

[berger]

I checked the german-language forum and they have discussed it already.

They mention 70'000 Swiss Francs paid by the Swiss military for a 712M in the early '70s, which at the time was equivalent to... about USD 17'500, so spot on Prof's estimate.

They also mention new prices in 1976 for the Austrian Army of 380'000 Austrian Shillings -still for a 712M-, equivalent to about USD 20'500. By comparison, the 710M was ATS 330'000, so about USD 17'800.

Thanks!

[audiocontr]

So, obviously, Pinz are bad investments!

[totaljoint]

So, obviously, Pinz are bad investments!

No, not for the original owners.
You see the Pinzgauer's were purchased by governments with taxpayer dollars, lets say $100,000 each.
The money came from the taxpayer, not the government, so cost to them was $0.00 (government prints the money, does not create the wealth).
They then sold them for about $2000/ea. That money stayed in the government's coffers (unlike Alaska oil money, I doubt the Swiss citizens saw a dividend check when the Pinzgauer stock was liquidated).
Plus, for the Austrian government, each truck provided employment to Austrian citizens who could now pay more taxes.

So each owner (governments) got not only the Pinz, but used it for years then made $2000/truck in sales.
I wish I could make such an investment!

[Dreadnought]

I don't know the cost new but I remember reading somewhere that Pinzgauers were offered to the British Army a long way back.......When asked what they could put up against it to compete with its off road performance, Landrover said we have nothing that comes near it off road, though I must ask, how often does that performance really get used? And we can sell you 4 long wheel base Landrovers for the price of 1 new Pinzgauer........guess what the British Army bought?

[BELied]

So here's some info for you guys I dug up. Profpinz is spot on with the '74 civi 710 costing around $16.5K AUD. At the exchange rates in 1974 it would equal about $24,000 USD. Now if you factor in the inflation from '74 to 2014 it comes out to about $115K give or take. Not a cheap truck.

[Dreadnought]

Not a cheap truck.......but have you ever tried to drill through a bulkhead on a Pinz?? that metal is pure quality.....in fact everything about it is pure quality....I suppose that's why the great cost.

[VinceAtReal4x4s]

An experienced body shop guy painted another G-wagen I had some years ago. He had to cut some rear panel metal out to fix some rust. When I showed up to check on things, he cussed at me saying he ruined two or three air-chisel bits while cutting the panel out and had never dealt with metal that was that strong. (New G's run around $100K)

[Profpinz]

I'II probably get shot for saying this, although I have eluded to it in the past, but in my opinion, the quality of the design, material, parts and assembly was much better on the 710/712 than it is was on the TDs.
Yes, the rustproofing, seam-sealing etc was better on the TD's but the earlier workmanship of the air-cooled range was exceptional.

[BELied]

I couldn't agree more. Although in general older things always have better workmanship.

[David Dunn]

I'II probably get shot for saying this, although I have eluded to it in the past, but in my opinion, the quality of the design, material, parts and assembly was much better on the 710/712 than it is was on the TDs.
Yes, the rustproofing, seam-sealing etc was better on the TD's but the earlier workmanship of the air-cooled range was exceptional.

Peter, The TD police will be at your home in the morning, please surrender your 718 to them peacefully.

For the most part I agree with you, but the TDs were a redesign for a broader and commercial market (or intended). The gas Pinzes were a wonderful initial design, but in the late ‘60s gas engines in MVs were on a decline, and the capable road speed were on the rise.
On the TDs, only the engine used was a failing point (political using the VW TD engine), I feel that every other change was an improvement over the 710/12. Power steering ( though a mess of hydraulics hoses) , all wheel disc brakes, wider spaced transfer case gear ratios between hi and low ( good highway speed and 712 type low range), and though many may cringe, the electro/pneumatic lockers are easy to deal with, maintain and repair. And before anyone is offended, if there is a failure, vacuum is a lot easier to deal with than hydraulic fluids, lines and master/slave cylinders.
As a side note: my 716 was the quietest of the 4 Pinzes I've own with vinyl matting and sound deadening material throughout the interior floor ( no undercoating), a commercial model. My present XM 718K may be on par with my 710M and 712M. They were all built to mil specs. The 710/12s had undercoating and the noise of the air cooled engine. The 718 has no undercoating or insulating flooring to deaden any road noise or metal resonation. The sides and roof only has a mild insulating covering. The doghouse is plastic and doesn't quiet things as much as the metal doghouse and insulating blanket on the 716... But I don't hear the noise. My smile from ear to ear pinches the ears shut.

Assembly was probably much better on a majority of the 710/12, as for most of the build span, there was a continuous production, and in the last years, as ordered. Roughly speaking, 17k+ gas Pinzes were made over 16 years ( most in the first 8/9 years, as contracts were filled (mainly Swiss and Austrian), then replacement orders mostly). On the other hand, less than 8k TD Pinzes made over 20+ years (between SDP and ATL). And (imho) it was only ATL contracts with “Commonwealth” countries that maintain the Pinzgauer after 1994ish (most SDP made) to the end in 2007+/-.

The Swiss were the goose with the golden eggs in the 60s/ early 70's to pay for the design and production of the 710/12s.. In the mid 70s, SDP found a new golden goose in Mercedes making the G Wagon, more conventional build, not as expensive and higher sales potential. In military circles, the Pinz was just too expensive to warrant for general service